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LT
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Post by LT »

Thanks for advice alan_m. I will check the RAM and double-check the voltages when I get the chance.

I have the TAP to control the interactive services already, so it's not that. I also have pruned the channel list to get rid of the junk, although I could probably still prune back more channels that I never watch, even though I think I might.
juwlz
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Post by juwlz »

On a 5810, it's really important to get down to a total of about 40 TV and Radio channels if you're running MyStuff. On a 5800, it's less critical, but can still have an impact on performance. See Toppy Memory for more info on that.

See Toppy Repairs for info on capacitor replacements, including service if you don't want to DIY, or kits if you do. Note that time is of the essence for hardware repairs. It's wise to repair ASAP once you spot a potential issue.

Julie
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Geoff Bacon
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Post by Geoff Bacon »

Your problem, after all those years, is almost certainly down to the PSU.

However, it would be a good idea to post the output of MyInfo Log (this shows your configuration). You can do this by manually copying the file or by using TopManager (TM will also create a forum signature for you).
Note: If you do post, suggest you do it in a new thread; this helps to keep this topic relevant.

When deleting gash channels, always use TopManager (pc) or the ChannelOrganiser tap. These ensure that you are scanning a single transmitter, provide easy deletion of unwanted channels and ensure that any tap initialization files are consistent. Theye also remember your channel lineup making it easy to perform future rescans/clean up.
Note: it is possibly to delete using the remote control but this is long winded, you may remove the "wrong" duplicates (if you have signals from more than one transmitter) and may leave incorrect entries in the .ini file. Unlike TM and CO, it is also a pain to remove the same set of channels next time you retune.

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Post by fhjones »

Geoff Bacon wrote: When deleting gash channels, always use TopManager (pc) or the ChannelOrganiser tap.

Geoff
:shock: Surely you mean trash channels Geoff?
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â„¢
LT
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Post by LT »

Thanks to Geoff and juwlz for more helpful tips.

I do use Channel Organiser and currently have 77 channels.
And I have 12.1 MB free memory.

So all looks good other than the PSU thing. I'm out tonight so can't re-check the voltages. Hopefully tomorrow.

I should say that 99% of the time it works absolutely perfectly. The delays in responding happen maybe once a week or less. Nevertheless, I appreciate that the PSU clock is ticking down.
juwlz
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Post by juwlz »

LT wrote:I do use Channel Organiser and currently have 77 channels.
I'll bet you could get that a lot closer to 40 without losing anything that you'd actually miss.

Julie
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LT
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Post by LT »

juwlz wrote:I'll bet you could get that a lot closer to 40 without losing anything that you'd actually miss.
Yes. I could probably get it down to 60-ish. Thing is, with using MyStuff and search timers, I never know when something will get a hit on some obscure channel that's never previously interested me. It has happened.

But anyhoo, back to PSU matters - I retested the voltages and got much the same results - A tenth of a volt here or there. 2 tenths on the larger voltages. I was going to put a new battery in my multimeter but then realised it takes a 9v and I don't have a new one of those to hand. I tried testing it on a known voltage - my laptop charger. Stated 19v and measured 18.87v. But that means, if anything, it's measuring low and the Toppy voltages that were either bang on or higher than spec. So I don't think the battery is a factor.

I did put it on a finer scale and got the 3.3v as 3.27. The 5s are still bang on.

But this is all an academic exercise I think. The upshot is that I'm lucky they are as good as they are at this age and I should do something about it before that stops being the case.

I will consider my options. Thanks for the help folks.
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Post by andyfras »

Voltage measurements are only part of the story. In a 5800 PSU there is one capacitor (C22) that has the most effect on voltages, but other capacitors can go out of specification, causing unpredicatable operation without having any effect on the measured voltages.

An oscilloscope would be needed to see the high frequency ripple on the PSU outputs due to these failing capacitors. Once this ripple becomes large enough to get through to the processor, disk and memory circuits, that's when the problems start.

I've seen several PSUs that have been 'repaired' by Turbosat at some stage. This usually comprised replacement of 3 capacitors. As these replacements are good quality, the voltages remain good, but as the remaining capacitors start to fail, the Toppy may have frequent crashes, disk corruption, and eventually the PSU may not start at all.
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LT
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Post by LT »

I've opted to avail myself of Andy's exchange service. Cheers.
Maxis
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Really strange problem

Post by Maxis »

Hi, please read - Really strange problem!

I changed capacitors to power board ORTP-831. All the voltages are ok (30V line a bit low 29,2V).

When powered, I put the power connector on the main board: system starts up. I take power cord off from the plug and back on, no sight off life! The voltages are then, e.g., on 15V line 4V or something. Many others are dead. But, if I remove the power connector off the main board, the voltages climb back to normal ! Seems like there is "obstacle" somewhere that prevents capacitors loading.

Do you have any idea what is the reason for this?


When not connected on the main board:

Mine Norm
0 0
15,1 15
0 0
3,3 3,3
0 0
5,2 5
0 0
7,8 8
0 0
16,4 17
22,3 22
29,2 30

12,1 12
0 0
0 0
5,3 5
DavidBelgium
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No idea what is wrong with this board ORTP-831

Post by DavidBelgium »

Hi,

A topfield PVR 4010 plus died with some smoke according to my father in law. When I inspected the board, I couldn't detect any bulged or burnt components.

I read this topic carefully and understood it would be necessary to replace all caps nevertheless. I replaced ALL electrolytics with panasonic quality caps.
I also replaced the V1 chip 1M0680R "to be sure"

However, when plugging the board back in, the transformer is not driven. When measuring over C5; I have approx 315 V. When measuring between the - pole of C5 and the common point between R1 and R3 ; I get 0V
So V1 is not starting because it gets no supply of >14V.
The resistors R1/R3 are within spec. I also replaced D2 & D1 with a comparable diode. Still no luck.

Heatsink is stone cold just like the resistors. So it doesn't seem to be that pin 3 is drawing any significant current due to a short.

Any help for this riddle would be much appreciated !
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Post by andyfras »

Maxis, sorry for the late reply, I missed your post.

I suspect that the HDD has a short on the 12V. There is a protection diode that goes short to protect the disk from excessive voltage (e.g. from a failing PSU), unfortunately this normally blows a chip (U51) on the Toppy mainboard. In your case it looks as though the chip did not blow, so the short is loading the PSU. Try unplugging the HDD power to see if the Toppy boots normally (apart from the disk of course).

If this is the case, the shorted diode can be removed from the disk, and in most cases the disk is OK. Ideally the diode should be replaced (I can supply), but unless your PSU goes out of specification again, it should be OK without it.
Last edited by andyfras on Sat Nov 15, 2014 12:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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andyfras
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Post by andyfras »

DavidBelgium, Check D2; if this is short circuit it will hold V1 pin3 at 0V (via a 10ohm resistor). Also check that C9 is the right way around (and the others too, while you're at it).

It is difficult to measure R1 in circuit, so it should be removed first. I have seen a couple of PSUs where R1 had failed.
Toppy PSU repair service or capacitor kits for DIY available - PM me for details.
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DavidBelgium
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Post by DavidBelgium »

Hi Andy

D2 was ok but it is new one soldered in after I couldn't trace the error
R1 was ok and R3 is also
Polarity of all caps were ok and I had replaced them all. No old one was left on the board.

However, I removed the new V1 chip and found out there was an almost short between pin3 and pin4 ; approx 20 ohms. Strange as I bought that component from ebay with long unsolder ed legs as a "new" one. I cannot imagine that it blew immediately when powering it up the first time after rework.
The old one doesn't have the short circuit between pin3 and pin4

Strange...maybe D2 was shot and killed the new V1 instantly on the first power up. I must admit I only looked at the diodes after testing and not finding the root cause.
DavidBelgium
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Post by DavidBelgium »

Another attempt... plugged it in and now I get just over 12v over C9 but still no power... According to the datasheet, the start threshold of V1 must be between 14 and 16v ; which is higher than what I measure.
:x :x

Mains voltage is 217 V, which is at the low side and voltage over the big cap is 303 V
I might need to play with the resistor value of R3 to change the voltage divider and to raise the voltage a tiny bit.
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