For technical discussions, work-arounds and fixes - not for general moans

Moderators: Technical, Oz mods

Post Reply
Abed
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:16 pm

Tp4001 power supply

Post by Abed »

Just swiftched my topfield t4000 after good six working year, and nothing worked. Stone dead. Removed power supply and checke fuse and it was ok. Now where is the next likely fault and how to test. I believe the power supply is the same as 5800. Help is respected
alan_m
Frequent contributor
Posts: 3551
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:11 am

Re: Tp4001 power supply

Post by alan_m »

Abed wrote:Just swiftched my topfield t4000 after good six working year, and nothing worked. Stone dead. Removed power supply and checke fuse and it was ok. Now where is the next likely fault and how to test. I believe the power supply is the same as 5800. Help is respected
Fuse in mains plug or fuse at the back of the PSU board?

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Topfield_5800/PSU_Repair

https://sites.google.com/site/andyfrase ... pvr-faults
Ex Toppy 5800 user - now migrated to Xtrend ET10000 Enigma 2 box with 2 terrestrial and 2 satellite tuners. Second box Zgemma H9S (Enigma 2, satellite)
andyfras
Frequent contributor
Posts: 3486
Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 2:41 pm
Location: Fleet, Hampshire
Contact:

Post by andyfras »

If your Toppy has not had new capacitors yet, it needs some now.
Toppy PSU repair service or capacitor kits for DIY available - PM me for details.
MyStuff 6.6 : Little Clock : MHEGOnOff : Extend : EPG2MEI : SecCache : EIT_Sub : TSSaver : Prune EPG
Channel Organiser : Tap Commander : HDD Info : PCControl : Signal Monitor : MyInfo
URC-7555 remote: TF5800 320GB 2.5", Recommended_5800.tfd + CfPePsScUUuWfZ
MDFMDF
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:47 pm
Location: Swindon

8 year old toppy with behavioural problems

Post by MDFMDF »

Hi,
Purchased in August 2006, my normally well behaved Toppy 5800 started displaying quirky problems a few month ago. E.g. the archive wouldn't display, there were gaps in the EPG listings, the channel wouldn't change, pause on playback would sometime hang etc. These problems were intermittent, but became more frequent. After some research here, I decided it was worth following the advice to replace the PSU Capacitors (C17, C18, C19, C22, C23 and C25) - the old ones were the fated Sam Young brand. So far my Toppy has been behaving itself - so many thanks to ANDYFRAS et al for the very informative help, advice, diagrams etc.

However, I decided to check the voltages and these are the values:
30 - 31.1 (0.1 over range)
22 - 25.1 (0.1 over range)
17 - 16.8
8 - 7.7 (0.1 over range)
5 - 5
3.3 - 3.3
15 - 15.5

These all look (just about) OK, but the voltage on the disk drive (unloaded without the drive attached) was 13.34. Does this imply, that although the Toppy is working well, there may be another underlying issue (perhaps another capacitor that needs replacing)?

Thanks
MDFMDF
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:47 pm
Location: Swindon

I spoke too soon

Post by MDFMDF »

After 5 or 6 hours of working well, it appears that something else is amiss now. I first noticed that I couldn't change channel. No other functions worked either. On re-starting, the disk spins up, then stops, then spins up again. The "checking files" message appears, but doesn't go away. The disk appears to be "clicking" struggling to read the disk. I've tried re-starting several times, now even the "checking files" message doesn't appear. Does this indicate the disk has given up the ghost?

Regards
Bizman
Frequent contributor
Posts: 1707
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 2:46 pm

Post by Bizman »

Stop playing with it before you make matters worse. You say you have changed 6 capacitors, that is only half the job. The disk file system is probably corrupt but that can be fixed, but first, switch it off from the mains before you do something expensive and get the power supply sorted.
TF5810, F/W: 5.15.09T 4/9/2009 -FmTe+EzHsVb
TAPs: EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; SecCache (UK) v0.4; MHEG On/Off A3; MPDisplayLITE V1.2; MyInfo B5.6; PruneEPG 1.0; EPG2MEI v0.96; QuickJump 1.72; Extend v1.7; (fsSave 1.1);
Sig generated by MyInfo on 3/8/17

Other TAPs : FsCheck, Channel Organiser. PSU Caps 7/2/2011 Tx: Mendip. TV: Samsung (32"), NSLU2, STB: Labgear FV300. PC Acer Aspire One with Win7 Starter
andyfras
Frequent contributor
Posts: 3486
Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 2:41 pm
Location: Fleet, Hampshire
Contact:

Post by andyfras »

The remaining 12 capacitors, which you have not changed, have no affect on the measured voltages but will cause problems when they fail, as they let through interference on the power rails to the main processor and other parts of the mainboard.

I have been recommending and supplying all 18 capacitors in my 5800 repairs and kits for some time. Also, I now recommend replacing all 13 capacitors in the the 5810 PSU.
Toppy PSU repair service or capacitor kits for DIY available - PM me for details.
MyStuff 6.6 : Little Clock : MHEGOnOff : Extend : EPG2MEI : SecCache : EIT_Sub : TSSaver : Prune EPG
Channel Organiser : Tap Commander : HDD Info : PCControl : Signal Monitor : MyInfo
URC-7555 remote: TF5800 320GB 2.5", Recommended_5800.tfd + CfPePsScUUuWfZ
MDFMDF
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:47 pm
Location: Swindon

Update

Post by MDFMDF »

Hi,
I thought it worth recording my experience after my original posts of 21st Feb and responses from Andyfras and Bizman. I contacted Andyfras and ordered the full set of capacitors on Saturday. They arrived on Monday (impressive) and I completed the upgrade to the power supply the same day, including the replacement of the 6 capacitors I'd already changed (just in case).

Unfortunately, my problems weren't completely solved. I could change channels and it didn't hang, but I still couldn't access the archive and the options format disk, record and time-shift were greyed out. The disk seemed to spin up and after a few seconds spin down, then spin up again. There were no clicking noises or error messages.

I decided to contact Andyfras and after much toing and froing of e-mails it was apparent my Hard Disk was faulty. I had tried transferring the disk to my old XP PC, but it wasn't "visible" using device manager or TopfHDRW. I tried various jumper settings and cradle locations all to no avail. However oddly, there were 2 intermittent occasions when the PC did recognise the disk. I was able to see it using Device Manager and TopfHDRW and I was able to run diagnostics. With some gusto I updated the disk, saved changes and plugged the disk back into the Toppy. Sadly, this still didn't work and when trying to "see" the disk on the PC subsequently it, again, would not work. After much grinding of teeth I decided to give up the fight and declare the disk faulty.

Luckily my old Dell PC had a second 80GB drive that was no longer of use. I popped this into the Toppy and bingo. So far all is well, albeit with reduced recording capacity. I'll just have to be more selective of what I record. To be honest, I'd had stuff on the old disk for years, so it probably was never going to be watched anyway.

I'd like to thank Andyfras for his knowledgeable help, responsiveness and patience.
Bizman
Frequent contributor
Posts: 1707
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 2:46 pm

Post by Bizman »

@MDFMDF, be advised that not all HDDs work in the Toppy so if you decide your present one has insufficient space see
Replacing your Hard Drive.
TF5810, F/W: 5.15.09T 4/9/2009 -FmTe+EzHsVb
TAPs: EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; SecCache (UK) v0.4; MHEG On/Off A3; MPDisplayLITE V1.2; MyInfo B5.6; PruneEPG 1.0; EPG2MEI v0.96; QuickJump 1.72; Extend v1.7; (fsSave 1.1);
Sig generated by MyInfo on 3/8/17

Other TAPs : FsCheck, Channel Organiser. PSU Caps 7/2/2011 Tx: Mendip. TV: Samsung (32"), NSLU2, STB: Labgear FV300. PC Acer Aspire One with Win7 Starter
MDFMDF
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:47 pm
Location: Swindon

Post by MDFMDF »

Thanks for the link Bizman.
kidhazy
Frequent contributor
Posts: 372
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 12:51 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Post by kidhazy »

My faithful TF5000PVRt looks like it's finally died.

I've been using at a holiday house for several years now and find it had died last week - with no clock display at all.

I had previously replaced the 6 main capacitors a couple of years ago.

I had some spare capacitors from the last time, so I swapped out again C17, C18, C22, C23, C25 (didn't have another cap to do C19).

The voltages are still generally low - and now I see the front display flickering with 4 zeroes, sometimes dropping down to 3 zeroes.

Probably a sign of larger problems - or requiring the remaining caps to be done.

I'm not going to spend too much time in trying to resolve this one, as I think the 5000PVRt has served me well, and may be time for it to be finally retired.

But - has anyone seen anything similar with the flashing zeroes, and is it PSU or mainboard related?

(I'm more curious, than wanting to spend too much time and $ to repair it)

Edit: Found an old post re the flashing 0000 which andyfras indicated needed D1 replaced (after replacing the caps). Does this still sound relevant to anyone? http://forum.toppy.org.uk/forum/viewtop ... 911#229911

Thanks,
Dean.
Thanks,
kidhazy.
juwlz
MyStuff Team
Posts: 10804
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2005 7:13 am
Location: Wokingham, Berkshire (Hannington transmitter)
Contact:

Post by juwlz »

General advice these days is to replace 18 capacitors - 6 is VERY out of date advice. See Toppy Repairs
5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+BmC0CfCtFsIMPePsR3UUuUxZ
5810, TS On, F/W: F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 +BmCfCtFsR3Z
MyStuff info; Help!; Reference
Harmony 885 remote. Sig date 8 April 2012
kidhazy
Frequent contributor
Posts: 372
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 12:51 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Post by kidhazy »

juwlz wrote:General advice these days is to replace 18 capacitors - 6 is VERY out of date advice. See Toppy Repairs
Oh, yes. I couldn't agree more - the replacement of the original 6 caps was a long time ago. I just tried the re-replacing of 5 of them as I had some spares sitting around.

I'm now more interested in the old post I found re D1 coming into play with the flashing zeroes (I hadn't read about flashing zeroes being related to caps before).

If I do go ordering new caps, I'd probably order a new D1 if I knew it was related to the problem.
Any easy way to test if D1 is an issue?

Cheers.
Thanks,
kidhazy.
LT
Regular contributor
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:35 pm
Location: Edinburgh (Craigkelly Tx)

Post by LT »

Hi folks,

I stumbled across discussion of the capacitor problem when looking for info about upgrading my hard drive (in the end I opted not to, at least not yet). My 5800 is 8 years old and has never given me any trouble worth speaking of, but I decided it might be best to check the voltages anyway since, from what I've read, problems will be inevitable sooner or later. I have noticed some small issues with responsiveness lately but just put it down to being busy doing something else.

My readings were thus:

Short Connector
5v = 5v
12v = 12.6v

Long Connector
30v = 31.9v
22v = 25.8v
17v = 17.6v
8v = 7.9v
5v = 5v
3.3v = 3.3v
15v = 16.2v

These don't seem too bad but I thought I'd ask for some second opinions.

Cheers.
alan_m
Frequent contributor
Posts: 3551
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:11 am

Post by alan_m »

LT wrote:Hi folks,

I stumbled across discussion of the capacitor problem when looking for info about upgrading my hard drive (in the end I opted not to, at least not yet). My 5800 is 8 years old and has never given me any trouble worth speaking of, but I decided it might be best to check the voltages anyway since, from what I've read, problems will be inevitable sooner or later. I have noticed some small issues with responsiveness lately but just put it down to being busy doing something else.

My readings were thus:

Short Connector
5v = 5v
12v = 12.6v

Long Connector
30v = 31.9v
22v = 25.8v
17v = 17.6v
8v = 7.9v
5v = 5v
3.3v = 3.3v
15v = 16.2v

These don't seem too bad but I thought I'd ask for some second opinions.

Cheers.
Some voltages do seem to be a bit high, especially the 15V line
(the 22V is actaully a mis-labelled 24V line and it usually sits at 24.5V and the 8V line usaully is around 7.5V).

Re-check your 5V line - and with a known good battery in your DVM. One common failing is the capacitors in the 5V line causing it to go low and as a result all the other volages go high except the 3.3V which has an additional regulator.

The main advice would be to replace the capacitors - they will go - its only a matter of time.

Non-reponsiveness is often down to having interactive services turned on all of the time. There is a TAP that can turn them on only when you are using them.

Also check that you have pruned your channel list to get rid of all the pay, porn and dross (and any radio stations that you don't use).

Check on the free RAM you have left - the Topopy only starts out with around 20Mbytes RAM and has trouble when you have less than 3/5Mbytes available.
Ex Toppy 5800 user - now migrated to Xtrend ET10000 Enigma 2 box with 2 terrestrial and 2 satellite tuners. Second box Zgemma H9S (Enigma 2, satellite)
Post Reply