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BobD
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:34 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 03 Aug 2005 Posts: 4218
I have also (of course) been reading the posts about expiry all day.

The issue has been made much worse by the fact that 4.03 expired without warning (either from it or from me Smile), rather than allowing a grace period in which people could upgrade to a newer version.

I do apologise for this, and I understand that many of you are also in the position of supporting friends/relatives, which only makes it worse.

I would repeat however, that this was never the intended behaviour, as I planned to release 4.5 long before 4.03 ever expired (which would not have prevented this discussion, but would have made it less intense!)

My current plan is to change the expiry method in the next version 4.51 so that it will never actually expire, but will instead just continue to display warning messages in N&N/EPG every few activations once the "expiry" data has passed.

I will not be releasing a non/delayed expiry version of 4.03, but 4.51 should be along fairly soon.

Cheers

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MyStuff skins, manual and latest version: http://www.BobDsMyStuff.co.uk
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CD3660
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:41 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 09 Apr 2005 Posts: 344 Location: Cheshire, UK
BobD, you are a gentleman and a scholar, but is it necessary to have repeated warnings displayed on screen?

This could be very disconcerting for the old folks! Wink

_________________
TF5800 Black Panther 250GB (x2)
Firmware: 5.13.65 (MyStuff Recommended Version)
Transmitter: Winter Hill.
Autostart TAPs (in load order): MyStuff 5.62a, Quickjump 1.71, eit2mei beta 7.8m3, ImproBox 2.1 RC8a, MeiSearch 1.35, UK Timers 1.2a, and Tap Commander 1.32
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Bawbagg
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:44 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 11 Aug 2005 Posts: 1122
pc1962 wrote:
Oh Bollocks,

Could they not have at least put the expiry date on the readme file. I mean this is a really nice piece of software and the guys responsible should be commended, I was even going to donate on paypal for their sterling efforts with 4.5. However, just received an email from SWMBO ranting that the toppy has defaulted back to the vanilla guide and all my control timers etc etc have vanished! Imagine my surprise when I found this thread. Well sorry, Im stuck in Africa for the next 5 weeks and will lose all my intended recordings and am bloody fuming!!!

For god sake just charge for the thing and be done with it. Ill gladly pay whatever you need, just get the wife off my back!!!

Would it be too much to ask to include a warning of the expiry date?

Totally cheesed off
Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed
The team are mortally embarrased about this. We're sorry that you're losing CTs.

I know BobD has already commented on this - but as a member of the team let me just state (for the public record)...... at NO POINT during the 3500 emails we exchanged during the development of 4.5 did we ONCE mention the expiry of 4.03.

It really is a complete coincidence that it happened the day after we released 4.5. A ridiculous coincidence... I know... but a coincidence nontheless. The reception in this thread that BobD (and the team) have had as a result of this (monumental) cock-up has been pretty harsh. We've learnt a tough lesson on this one.

Would the comments be the same if 4.03 had expired and there was NO NEW public release???? I suspect not. It would have been a nasty situation, and we'd have had to deal with it. I'm disgusted at those who have discussed/proposed a conspiracy. And I'm fairly disgusted at the tone of a lot of these posts.

It's not right to be fuming. I know you must be frustrated, but you mustn't be fuming. That's not in the spirit of this forum, and not in the spirit of MyStuff. I'm not aiming this post directly in response of pc1962 (quoted). It's also aimed at all the recent complaint posts in this thread. Please bear in mind you exercised your choice when you loaded MyStuff on your's and your friend's and family's machines. It is YOUR responsibility to fix it. That's generally the way free software works. Use it at your own risk.

The only reason this incident has occured is because MyStuff is free. If BobD were charging for this then fair enough - you have cause for complaint. But he's not. If you donated, then good show (and again... we're sorry we cocked up). If not, then donate. If MyStuff was a charge-for product, then we might have spent the last 10 months developing a rock solid anti-theft process, and MyStuff might be without half the features it has today.

Major issues, like this, are the main reason BobD does not (and is likely not to) introduce charging for MyStuff.

Please, no more complaints on what is essentially free software. We've taken the comments on board (just the same way we take on comments about wanting any other changes made). They're now in Hyde's Changelog Very Happy.

Please return to the spirit of the forum - if you have a problem, please post it, and we'll do what we can to help. With a Very Happy.

'Nuff said.

BB

_________________
TAPs: MyStuff Something or other + whatever CW recommends
MEI readme and latest version at http://my.opera.com/bawbagg
Current MyStuff Known Bugs http://www.BobDsMyStuff.co.uk/Bugs.shtml
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AndyD
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:52 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 02 Oct 2005 Posts: 102
I totally fail to see why there has to be an expirey date or nag or anything else. I was quite happily using 4.03, it was stable & did everything I wanted. Not supporting older versions is understandable, but forcing people to fix/update something that "aint broke" is just plain stupid.

I am very apreciative of the team's work, and I am sure they are happy that so many people use their product......so why not let them keep using it.

I VERY much hope you remove all timeouts and nags from your s/w.

Thanks.
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Magic Man
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 11:00 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 206 Location: South Wales
I have to say that I am amazed and even disgusted by the attitude of some people here towards the MyStuff developers.

The work done in the application is nothing short of fantastic in both features and dedication. To those "fuming" and the like - put your dummy back in and grow up. This is not official software or anything you've paid a license for and it is exactly that sort of attitude that could end up making the MyStuff team simply say b*ll*cks to the whole thing and leave us with the standard guide - I've seen it happen elsewhere plenty of times. You've lost a few TV programmes - wow, real end of world stuff.

I, like many others here, offer my uttermost respect and thanks to those invlolved in the MyStuff development and urge them not to be knocked back by the responses of others but to simply carry on as normal with their lives and, hopefully, the continued development of MyStuff.

Cheers guys... Very Happy
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CD3660
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 11:03 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 09 Apr 2005 Posts: 344 Location: Cheshire, UK
Bawbagg wrote:
Please, no more complaints on what is essentially free software. We've taken the comments on board (just the same way we take on comments about wanting any other changes made). They're now in Hyde's Changelog Very Happy.

Please return to the spirit of the forum - if you have a problem, please post it, and we'll do what we can to help. With a Very Happy.

'Nuff said.

BB


I think it may be time for everyone to 'step away from the thread!' whilst Hyde reaches for his padlock! Wink

_________________
TF5800 Black Panther 250GB (x2)
Firmware: 5.13.65 (MyStuff Recommended Version)
Transmitter: Winter Hill.
Autostart TAPs (in load order): MyStuff 5.62a, Quickjump 1.71, eit2mei beta 7.8m3, ImproBox 2.1 RC8a, MeiSearch 1.35, UK Timers 1.2a, and Tap Commander 1.32
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Bawbagg
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 11:05 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 11 Aug 2005 Posts: 1122
AndyD wrote:
forcing people to fix/update something that "aint broke" is just plain stupid.
The largest software company in the world do this. I'm not saying it's right, but it's the way things have happened with 4.03.

How BobD and the team choose to do things in future is still up for discussion.

I'll say it again. Please, no more negative comments. I suspect we'll be locking this thread soon anyway, 'cos the focus of our work is 4.5.

Right now, the only way out your problem is to upgrade to 4.5. We're working hard on fixing the issues.

BB

_________________
TAPs: MyStuff Something or other + whatever CW recommends
MEI readme and latest version at http://my.opera.com/bawbagg
Current MyStuff Known Bugs http://www.BobDsMyStuff.co.uk/Bugs.shtml
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Bawbagg
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 11:06 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 11 Aug 2005 Posts: 1122
CD3660 wrote:
I think it may be time for everyone to 'step away from the thread!' whilst Hyde reaches for his padlock! Wink
Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

_________________
TAPs: MyStuff Something or other + whatever CW recommends
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Current MyStuff Known Bugs http://www.BobDsMyStuff.co.uk/Bugs.shtml
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AndyD
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 11:41 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 02 Oct 2005 Posts: 102
Bawbagg wrote:
The largest software company in the world do this. I'm not saying it's right, but it's the way things have happened with 4.03.


Thanks for the comments,
there are hundreds of schools still using Windows98 PCs and even though there are no updates or support it does not refuse to boot up or run.

Bawbagg wrote:
How BobD and the team choose to do things in future is still up for discussion.


Bob has said he won't release an eternal version of 4.03.....which is a real shame Sad I can only hope he eventually sees the problem from a user's perspective as well as from his own.

Bawbagg wrote:
I'll say it again. Please, no more negative comments. I suspect we'll be locking this thread soon anyway, 'cos the focus of our work is 4.5.


I hope most have been seen as "contructive criticism", whether everyone thinks users of free software are allowed to complain or not Wink
I hope none of you take anything personally.
It's very interesting to see so much enthusiasm & emotion about MyStuff....you must have some pride in so much interest ?

Bawbagg wrote:
Right now, the only way out your problem is to upgrade to 4.5. We're working hard on fixing the issues.

BB


Looking forward to seeing 4.51, thanks for all the team's hard work Smile
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Bawbagg
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 11:54 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 11 Aug 2005 Posts: 1122
AndyD wrote:
there are hundreds of schools still using Windows98 PCs and even though there are no updates or support it does not refuse to boot up or run.
The single, subtle difference is that they BOUGHT a product. They bought a product with an implied warranty. Nobody bought a copy MyStuff, nor did it come with any warranty (implied or otherwise). As I said - if you donated, then thanks. In any case, you know that something will be along soon.

AndyD wrote:
Bob has said he won't release an eternal version of 4.03.....which is a real shame Sad I can only hope he eventually sees the problem from a user's perspective as well as from his own.
It's not that BobD won't release...... he can't...... Trust me... we'd be helping you out if we could....... 4.03 can never be compiled again. Crying or Very sad

AndyD wrote:
Looking forward to seeing 4.51, thanks for all the team's hard work Smile
Cheers.

BB

_________________
TAPs: MyStuff Something or other + whatever CW recommends
MEI readme and latest version at http://my.opera.com/bawbagg
Current MyStuff Known Bugs http://www.BobDsMyStuff.co.uk/Bugs.shtml
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eye of ra
Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:09 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 28 Dec 2005 Posts: 1018
Have come into this a bit late, upgraded immediately. Just popped in to see why this tread was still growing. Having read through it I will now repeat Magic Man as this is exactly my feelings.


Magic Man wrote:
I have to say that I am amazed and even disgusted by the attitude of some people here towards the MyStuff developers.

The work done in the application is nothing short of fantastic in both features and dedication. To those "fuming" and the like - put your dummy back in and grow up. This is not official software or anything you've paid a license for and it is exactly that sort of attitude that could end up making the MyStuff team simply say b*ll*cks to the whole thing and leave us with the standard guide - I've seen it happen elsewhere plenty of times. You've lost a few TV programmes - wow, real end of world stuff.

I, like many others here, offer my uttermost respect and thanks to those invlolved in the MyStuff development and urge them not to be knocked back by the responses of others but to simply carry on as normal with their lives and, hopefully, the continued development of MyStuff.

Cheers guys... Very Happy


I do however agree with nicholsr

nicholsr wrote:
??MyStuff is your software, provided free so its your right to add an expiry timer to it if you want to. I can see the line of reasoning that led to it.

Think hard about this though. There is no obligation on you to provide any kind of support - for old version or for current versions. Its quite reasonable for you to say that you will not answer any questions on the old versions - people have to move up if they want your help.

If users with out of date versions of mystuff report bugs then you wont even need to append to the forum telling them to get the new version - because others will get there first and give this advice on your behalf.

For my own personal use, the auto-destruct feature is not a problem but its a big problem for those people who set up MyStuff on friends and relative's machines - Something I had been considering doing?..


EoR

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Toppy: 5800. Firmware: 5.13.65 Patched
AutoStart: MyStuff 5.62a | MP3 Jukebox 2.1d | WSSkiller 2.12d | Quickjump 1.69
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jindod
Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 7:27 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 12 Dec 2005 Posts: 285
Yes, all the people who selflessly devote hours upon hours to improving a box in my front room for no money whatsoever are among the most selfish imaginable.

You'll burn in hell for your 'upgrade once in a while' antics!

If i had my way your names would be added to the sex offenders register by default.

That'd show you.
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chunkywizard
Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 7:53 am Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 13 May 2005 Posts: 9319 Location: Sindlesham, Berkshire Tx: Hannington
Hi Jindod,

we can always rely on you Wink

At least we now have a flavour of your sense of humour, twisted as it is.

Hope you have upgraded, that vanilla guide and lack of CTs with start to grate soon Laughing

CW

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BobD
Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:30 am Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 03 Aug 2005 Posts: 4218
Chris.Day wrote:
I think some people are over-reacting. Just because a piece of software is free doesn't mean that it shouldn't be criticised. How would it improve? Firefox is free, and it gets plenty of criticism (and is better for it). Same for many open-source packages.

I agree, and the entire history of MyStuff is one of us listening to users and adding/adjusting MyStuff vesions.

Quote:
Of course, there is a fine line between constructive criticism and downright product bashing, and when frustrated with something it can be very easy to step over it. Surely even those of you who are attacking those who don't agree with the expiry can see where they're coming from?

Not that I consider myself to be attacking anyone, but yes, of course I can see where some of the complaints are coming from. It must be very fustrating for people who are suddenly left without a working copy of 4.03 (though most people should be able to upgrade to get round that, and we are working on fixing the bugs in 4.5 as quickly as we can). It was a mistake that 4.03 expired without giving everyone months to upgrade to a new version, the whole process should have been a lot less painful!

It can be a little hard to read some of the posts here after you have just spent many (many, many) long hours getting a new version ready to release. So just as we can see things from the point of view of you users, so some people need to try to see things from ours.

Quote:
This forum is quickly becoming a hostile environment (or at least that's how it feels), and I for one will think twice before posting any "negative" comments about TAPs, if this is the kind of response that it gets.

Please do not stop posting as a result of this round of posts. It is not typical! Some of the posts against expiry (some of the initial ones) have been a little strong and those that have jumped in to defend us are I think largely reacting to those, rather than just being fanboyism.

We have/are and continuing to listen to points raised on these threads (about general features and about expiry issues) and will take decisions for future versions based on that.

_________________
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TAPs:
MyStuff (always one version ahead of everyone else!), and recommended support TAPS
MyStuff skins, manual and latest version: http://www.BobDsMyStuff.co.uk
Known bugs & forthcoming fixes: http://www.BobDsMyStuff.co.uk/Bugs.shtml
Changes coming in the next version: http://www.BobDsMyStuff.co.uk/NextVersion.shtml
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underquark
Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:50 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 1790
Imagine if a garage had a pump that dispensed free petrol and then - one day - you found the pump empty because the garage owner had not anticipated that it was about to run empty so soon but he had fully intended to fill it again just as soon as he had the time. If you couldn't get to work that day because you had no petrol then I'd say that you would have to shoulder a fair part of the blame yourself.

We know that the new version - 4.5 - will start to annoy in December and then shuffle off its mortal in March. Plenty of warning but I bet we'll still get whining at that time.

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A 5800 and a 5810 still in use with various dead ones and bits lying around, one Toppy with UPS and dedicated aerial; MyStuff 6.6; QuickJump 1.72; EPG2 MEI; Various remotes - URC1056B01 (my fav.), URC11-7140 R02 (to learn new codes) programmed using tools from the excellent JP1 site.
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