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toothandnail
Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 10:36 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Posts: 77
I think I've suffered some hard drive corruption on my 5800. Due to a move, my router now sits pretty close to the TV and the Toppy. I replaced the lousy ISP-provided router with a TP-Link capable of both 2.4 and 5 GHz wifi. I noticed some breakup problems with some TV channels - mainly the low number ones. That is probably what started the trouble.... I've currently got the 5 GHz wifi disabled, which seems to have fixed the problem, at least until I can get the router further away from the TV equipment or get some filtration installed.

A couple of days ago, I came home after a night shift and found the Toppy rebooting conscientiously. In order to get it started again, I forced a start without taps, then moved the taps from the autostart directory. I'm now copying data off the hard drive (there were quite a few unwatched programs on it) with the intention of formatting the drive and reinstalling everything. That is going to take quite a bit of time, and in the meantime I'm finding that there seems to be no data in the native EPG.

Could the lack of a native EPG be due to my moving everything out of the autostart directory, or is it likely to be from some other cause? I'm reluctant to do a retune, since the last few times I've done so, its taken a lot of fiddling to get the channels correct.

Paul.

_________________
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+Ta
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.4; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub v0.6; MyInfo B5.5;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 29/5/11
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alan_m
Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 11:38 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 18 Oct 2006 Posts: 3492
The native EPG data is not saved to hard disk and is fetched every time the box is switched on. The collection may take 10 to 20 minutes or longer if you have a suspect reception.

TAPs such as Mystuff And EPG Navigator save the EPG to hard disk so that it instantly available on the next switch on. These TAP then quietly collect the broadcast EPG as a background slow time task to keep it up to date. If you delete the Mystuff EPG data files Mystuff also takes 10 to 20 minutes to automatically build up a new EPG file - which it then saves to disk.

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Ex Toppy 5800 user - now migrated to Extrend ET10000 Enigma 2 box with 2 terrestrial and 2 satellite tuners
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Geoff Bacon
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 12:23 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 4384
I think the native epg should be available almost instantaneously after the toppy boots - it is just that it will have lots of holes in it while it is being assembled in memory.

Have you had all 18 capacitors changed on the Toppy? If not, this is your first priority and you should switch it off until they have been replaced (contact andyfras to do the work or supply a kit if you have the skills).
i.e. stop copying data off it until the psu has been repaired

You signature says that you are still using MyStuff 6.4; if this is the case then you need to upgrade to 6.6 (this reduces calls to a system service that is implicated in cause disk corruption + other things). The MS installer (assuming you have a windows pc) also installs my PruneEPG tap (essential to prevent holes in the EPG caused by the buffer overflowing due to the plethora of channels that now exist).
Do NOT upgrade the software until after you have had the psu checked/repaired.

AFTER the psu is fixed, you can perform channel scan using the latest (B2.1) ChannelOrganiser tap or using the TopManager PcControl| Channel Management option. Using either of these programs (they share data files so changes made in one will be detected by the other) restrict the scan to a single transmitter (eliminating most duplicates), provide simple ways to delete all PPSS (Pay, Porn, Shopping, Social etc) channels and remember what channels have been deleted making future channel scans/deletions a doddle.
Scanning and/or deleting channels by any other means is highly likely to cause problems unless you really know what you are doing.
Again, do not perfrom a scan before the psu has been checked/repaired - failing psus have been known to cause tuners to fail when a scan is performed.

TopManager had lots of functions that can help you manage the toppy (link in my signature)

If the disk is really corrupted, I should be able to get the data back using a program I have written (ToppyDiskMedic) - but you would need to send the disk to me. Hopefully, you haven't reached this stage.

To summarize - switch off the toppy and get the psu checked/repaired before you try using it again.

Geoff

_________________
TopManager program
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+EvEzPfUUuZ
TAPs: PcControl B1.4; StopExit v1.01; PruneEPG 1.0; fsSave 1.1; QuickJump 1.72; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.6; Bookmark 3.0; Extend v1.7; Font Manager 1.0d; MyInfo B5.6; MHEG On/Off A3;
Sig generated by EMJB's MyInfo.tap on 29/12/18
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juwlz
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:18 am Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 12 Aug 2005 Posts: 10801 Location: Wokingham, Berkshire (Hannington transmitter)
I would agree with Geoff. If you've never had the PSU repaired/replaced since 2009, you can save yourself a lot of time and effort by simply getting that done. Most Toppy faults that look like disk corruption are actually PSU failure, and formatting (or even replacing) the hard drive without a full PSU repair is a waste of time and money.

See Toppy Repairs for more information.

Julie

_________________
5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+BmC0CfCtFsIMPePsR3UUuUxZ
5810, TS On, F/W: F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 +BmCfCtFsR3Z
MyStuff info; Help!; Reference
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toothandnail
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 3:48 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Posts: 77
alan_m wrote:
The native EPG data is not saved to hard disk and is fetched every time the box is switched on. The collection may take 10 to 20 minutes or longer if you have a suspect reception.


Hmm. Odd. I've not seen any reception problems since I disabled the 5 GHz wifi, but last time I looked, there was still no sign of any data in the native EPG

Quote:
TAPs such as Mystuff And EPG Navigator save the EPG to hard disk so that it instantly available on the next switch on. These TAP then quietly collect the broadcast EPG as a background slow time task to keep it up to date. If you delete the Mystuff EPG data files Mystuff also takes 10 to 20 minutes to automatically build up a new EPG file - which it then saves to disk.


Shouldn't be a factor here - I've currently got no taps running (or at least, I don't think I have...

Paul.

_________________
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+Ta
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.4; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub v0.6; MyInfo B5.5;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 29/5/11
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toothandnail
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 4:02 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Posts: 77
Geoff Bacon wrote:
I think the native epg should be available almost instantaneously after the toppy boots - it is just that it will have lots of holes in it while it is being assembled in memory.


That's what I thought, which is why I was concerned when it failed to populate.

Quote:
Have you had all 18 capacitors changed on the Toppy? If not, this is your first priority and you should switch it off until they have been replaced (contact andyfras to do the work or supply a kit if you have the skills).
i.e. stop copying data off it until the psu has been repaired


Its been 2 or 3 years, but I used one of andyfras's kits to upgrade the caps in both my 5800s. Hopefully they should both still be good. The one that is currently giving me problems also has a SATA bridge and a 1TB Samsung hard drive installed. The older one is currently out of service, have to find it since my move...

Quote:
You signature says that you are still using MyStuff 6.4; if this is the case then you need to upgrade to 6.6 (this reduces calls to a system service that is implicated in cause disk corruption + other things). The MS installer (assuming you have a windows pc) also installs my PruneEPG tap (essential to prevent holes in the EPG caused by the buffer overflowing due to the plethora of channels that now exist).
Do NOT upgrade the software until after you have had the psu checked/repaired.


Smile The Toppy has been pretty reliable for a while. I've never quite got round to upgrading Mystuff. Once I finish cleaning things up, I'll be putting 6.6 in, but I think I might be better doing that as a fresh install, after reformatting the drive.

Quote:
AFTER the psu is fixed, you can perform channel scan using the latest (B2.1) ChannelOrganiser tap or using the TopManager PcControl| Channel Management option. Using either of these programs (they share data files so changes made in one will be detected by the other) restrict the scan to a single transmitter (eliminating most duplicates), provide simple ways to delete all PPSS (Pay, Porn, Shopping, Social etc) channels and remember what channels have been deleted making future channel scans/deletions a doddle.


My 5800 is at least one retune behind, but I'd been putting it off due to problems I've had with recent retunes. I've used both fastscangui and channelorganiser, not tried TopManager (don't run Windows often). I'll try channelorganiser once I've got everything else sorted out (or find a suitable USB lead and try TopManager).

Quote:
Scanning and/or deleting channels by any other means is highly likely to cause problems unless you really know what you are doing.
Again, do not perfrom a scan before the psu has been checked/repaired - failing psus have been known to cause tuners to fail when a scan is performed.


Well, I hope my PSU is still ok, but I'll have a look and see if there are any voltages I can check, and have a look at the state of the caps - haven't had the lid off the 5800 in a long time...

Quote:
TopManager had lots of functions that can help you manage the toppy (link in my signature)


Smile Pity there isn't a Linux version - I'd use it for sure....

Quote:
If the disk is really corrupted, I should be able to get the data back using a program I have written (ToppyDiskMedic) - but you would need to send the disk to me. Hopefully, you haven't reached this stage.


Don't think its that much of a problem on the 1 TB disk. I saw mention of you looking for disks to check in another thread. I do have one, if I can only find it - a 320 GB WD that I had to pull because it could no longer be read. If I can find it (there are lots of things I've not seen since the move), I'll happily send it to you for checking.

Quote:
To summarize - switch off the toppy and get the psu checkedrepaired before you try using it again.

Geoff


Thanks. I will do that...

Paul.

_________________
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+Ta
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.4; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub v0.6; MyInfo B5.5;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 29/5/11
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toothandnail
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 4:05 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Posts: 77
juwlz wrote:
I would agree with Geoff. If you've never had the PSU repaired/replaced since 2009, you can save yourself a lot of time and effort by simply getting that done. Most Toppy faults that look like disk corruption are actually PSU failure, and formatting (or even replacing) the hard drive without a full PSU repair is a waste of time and money.

See Toppy Repairs for more information.

Julie


Thanks Julie. As I said to Geoff, I've used the capacitor kits in the past. Hopefully the supply is still good, but I'll look at it before I reformat the drive. That's going to be a little way off yet - gFTP tells me the ETA for the copying its doing at the moment is still 18 hours away, and there is more to come after that, even if I dump stuff that I'm not likely to ever get round to watching....

Paul.

_________________
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+Ta
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.4; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub v0.6; MyInfo B5.5;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 29/5/11
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Geoff Bacon
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 4:26 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 4384
Re your move - is that just the toppy moving in the same house or have you relocated (and possibly to a different transmission area)?

Please delete FastScanGUI - it's internal structures are way out of date and will cause major issues if your region was affected by the digital rollout i.e. it would be unusual if your region wasn't affected.

I didn't realize that you were copying files across the USB - most people connect the disk directly to a windows pc and use TopfHDRW to copy the files (much much faster). The only real gotchas are that you must copy anything you want in \ProgramFiles... via the USB (both directions) and that the disk needs to be reformatted in the toppy (and not with TopfHDRW)

Geoff

_________________
TopManager program
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+EvEzPfUUuZ
TAPs: PcControl B1.4; StopExit v1.01; PruneEPG 1.0; fsSave 1.1; QuickJump 1.72; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.6; Bookmark 3.0; Extend v1.7; Font Manager 1.0d; MyInfo B5.6; MHEG On/Off A3;
Sig generated by EMJB's MyInfo.tap on 29/12/18
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toothandnail
Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:43 am Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Posts: 77
Geoff Bacon wrote:
Re your move - is that just the toppy moving in the same house or have you relocated (and possibly to a different transmission area)?


Other side of the same town - if anything I'm a little closer to the Oxford transmitter.

Quote:
Please delete FastScanGUI - it's internal structures are way out of date and will cause major issues if your region was affected by the digital rollout i.e. it would be unusual if your region wasn't affected.


I think the last time I did a retune, I used the native tune, then used ChannelOrganiser to remove unwanted stations. Using ChannelOrganiser to do the whole lot resulted in a number of missing stations. May not be remembering that correctly though.... I don't think I've got a copy of FastScanGUI anymore, so I'll not download it again.

Quote:
I didn't realize that you were copying files across the USB - most people connect the disk directly to a windows pc and use TopfHDRW to copy the files (much much faster). The only real gotchas are that you must copy anything you want in \ProgramFiles... via the USB (both directions) and that the disk needs to be reformatted in the toppy (and not with TopfHDRW)

Geoff


Smile The only spare hard drive I had with sufficient capacity to take the data has a Linux file system and already has some data on it, so I didn't have a lot of choice. I'll remember the option for when I find the other Toppy though - the USB/FTP route is certainly not fast.

Paul.

_________________
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+Ta
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.4; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub v0.6; MyInfo B5.5;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 29/5/11
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