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Bundy
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 10:26 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 29 May 2006 Posts: 151
juwlz wrote:
Search for a copy of EmptySettings and install it as if it was firmware. This will Factory Reset the box, and should let you recover normally from there on.


Thanks for the suggestion, but unfortunately, it didn't work. I tried to install EmptySettings as firmware using TFDN_USB but I just got the reset message again and it was prevented from downloading. I tried it switching on from the mains instead of standby, as someone suggested this might work when the standby start-up wouldn't.

_________________
TF5810, IA On, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.5; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; MyInfo B5.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 5/12/13
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nvingo
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 12:55 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 07 Jul 2010 Posts: 102 Location: Norfolk
It's coming back to me now, that the similar issue I had with the Toppy, was that hundreds of rogue events had been set by the system. In my case they were mostly for BBC News channel, possibly as a series match for Click which I had set.
I had to manually delete each one.

_________________
TF5800, IA On, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Xl+Pe
TAPs: toppypal v3.4; EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.4; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; MyInfo B5.5; Surfer v0.14; PcControl X25a;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 17/4/12
?
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alan_m
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 3:50 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 18 Oct 2006 Posts: 3511
Bundy wrote:
juwlz wrote:
Search for a copy of EmptySettings and install it as if it was firmware. This will Factory Reset the box, and should let you recover normally from there on.


Thanks for the suggestion, but unfortunately, it didn't work. I tried to install EmptySettings as firmware using TFDN_USB but I just got the reset message again and it was prevented from downloading. I tried it switching on from the mains instead of standby, as someone suggested this might work when the standby start-up wouldn't.



If switching on from the mains leave the power off for at least 2 minutes.

Exactly what is happening? What front panel indications are you getting when you boot up?

Assuming that you have the correct Toppy USB drivers installed on your computer and you are using TFDN_USB rather than the similarly named TFD_Down, which is for a RS232 download, then the Toppy should not boot as normal. Almost immediatelty after applying power it should pick up the emptysettings or firmware and report END. Emtysettings will only take a few seconds whilst firmware perhaps 30 seconds with a countdown shown on the toppy front panel.

From the help pages
Quote:

Windows users can update using the TFDN_USB application, found in the Topfield group on the Programs menu. Start the program, and click the Find button. Browse to the location where you downloaded the firmware you want to install, and double click on the file. You?ll be returned to the main window. Now, connect your PVR to the PC, and make sure it is in standby. Next, click the Download button in TFDN_USB and then press the power button on the front of the PVR.

The front panel display will show the letters ?dn? followed by a countdown, which may repeat, then ?AP? followed by a countdown, and finally the message ?End?. You may also see four flashing dots, on a TF5800. The firmware update has completed when you see the ?End? message.

_________________
Ex Toppy 5800 user - now migrated to Extrend ET10000 Enigma 2 box with 2 terrestrial and 2 satellite tuners
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Bundy
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 10:21 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 29 May 2006 Posts: 151
alan_m wrote:


If switching on from the mains leave the power off for at least 2 minutes.


It's possible that I did not leave it off long enough. I'm away from home at present and have left it switched off, so I'll try again when I get home.

alan_m wrote:

Exactly what is happening? What front panel indications are you getting when you boot up?


I'm getting the usual front panel loading/run display, not what I usually get when downloading firmware.

alan_m wrote:

Assuming that you have the correct Toppy USB drivers installed on your computer and you are using TFDN_USB rather than the similarly named TFD_Down, which is for a RS232 download, then the Toppy should not boot as normal. Almost immediatelty after applying power it should pick up the emptysettings or firmware and report END. Emtysettings will only take a few seconds whilst firmware perhaps 30 seconds with a countdown shown on the toppy front panel.


I'm definitely using TFD_USB. The fact that I'm not able to download firmware suggests to me that something quite serious has happened.

Thanks for your help.

_________________
TF5810, IA On, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.5; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; MyInfo B5.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 5/12/13
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juwlz
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 1:56 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 12 Aug 2005 Posts: 10802 Location: Wokingham, Berkshire (Hannington transmitter)
Bundy wrote:
I'm definitely using TFD_USB. The fact that I'm not able to download firmware suggests to me that something quite serious has happened.
It may just suggest that your USB port on the Toppy isn't working.

Julie

_________________
5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+BmC0CfCtFsIMPePsR3UUuUxZ
5810, TS On, F/W: F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 +BmCfCtFsR3Z
MyStuff info; Help!; Reference
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Bundy
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 4:01 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 29 May 2006 Posts: 151
juwlz wrote:
It may just suggest that your USB port on the Toppy isn't working.

Julie


I tested out Altair before I tried the download. Not only was I able to see the files on the toppy, but I could copy new ones too. So, I don't think it can be faulty USB connection.

Thanks.

_________________
TF5810, IA On, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.5; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; MyInfo B5.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 5/12/13
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ccs
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 4:32 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 30 Oct 2007 Posts: 2588
Antares can be used to download firmware onto a 5810.

Just double-click the one you want.

_________________
TF5810, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -FmXl+CtEzIScVdZ
TAPs: EIT Sub v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MPDisplayLITE V1.2; MyInfo B5.6; SecCache (UK) v0.4; Extend v1.7; MyStuff 6.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 20/10/14
ccsx
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Geoff Bacon
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 5:34 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 4422
It sounds as though your disk has been trashed and it is asking you to reformat the disk; this typically happens when signal quality drops.

However, before going down that route:-

Can you see any files on the disk using TopManager, Altair or Antares?
If yes, try booting tapless (hold 0 down until picture shows) and see if it comes up. Note: booting tapless to ensure that MyStuff doesn't create/reinstate any timers

If you can't boot tapless, suggest you try disconnecting the disk in the toppy and seeing if it works as a simple freeview box. If this doesn't work, try downloading EmptySettings with TFDN_USB.

Note: You may have to native scan for channels

Assuming the toppy is now working without the disk, remove the disk and connect it up to a windows pc and diagnose/fix using TopfHDRW.
After fixing the disk (or copying off anything that might be useful!), put it back in the toppy and try again (tapless).

Please report back on the results.

Geoff

_________________
TopManager program
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+EvEzPfUUuZ
TAPs: PcControl B1.4; StopExit v1.01; PruneEPG 1.0; fsSave 1.1; QuickJump 1.72; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.6; Bookmark 3.0; Extend v1.7; Font Manager 1.0d; MyInfo B5.6; MHEG On/Off A3;
Sig generated by EMJB's MyInfo.tap on 29/12/18
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ccs
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 5:46 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 30 Oct 2007 Posts: 2588
Bundy wrote:
I tested out Altair before I tried the download. Not only was I able to see the files on the toppy, but I could copy new ones too. So, I don't think it can be faulty USB connection.
Geoff Bacon wrote:
It sounds as though your disk has been trashed and it is asking you to reformat the disk; this typically happens when signal quality drops.
I don't think the disc sounds too bad at the moment.

_________________
TF5810, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -FmXl+CtEzIScVdZ
TAPs: EIT Sub v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MPDisplayLITE V1.2; MyInfo B5.6; SecCache (UK) v0.4; Extend v1.7; MyStuff 6.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 20/10/14
ccsx
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Geoff Bacon
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:02 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 4422
@ccs
It is not really obvious what the disk state is: here To summarize:
Quote:

Now it's gone from bad to worse. I thought I'd take the nuclear option of reinstalling the firmware, to see if that would help. But the toppy was ahead of me. When I turned it on it was displaying the message "Firmware was changed with a latest one. Reset all data is highly recommended. Will you proceed?" with "yes" and "no" options. I can toggle between these options but the toppy will not react to the ok button on either option. I can't get rid of the message. Even a power cycle will not change it.


I can't see any posts indicating that he has got past this dialogue.

I believe that disconnecting the disk will allow him to bypass this point and download EmptySettings

That is why I suggested trying tapless before removing the disk. Assuming he can boot tapless, he can do a native scan and this will erase any timers.
He can then boot without MyStuff and check that all appears well. If it then fails when MS is started, that implies that it's config files are knackerd.

The rest of my post was based on the disk not being usable.

Anway, what we really need is more info from the op about the state of the toppy.

Geoff

_________________
TopManager program
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+EvEzPfUUuZ
TAPs: PcControl B1.4; StopExit v1.01; PruneEPG 1.0; fsSave 1.1; QuickJump 1.72; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.6; Bookmark 3.0; Extend v1.7; Font Manager 1.0d; MyInfo B5.6; MHEG On/Off A3;
Sig generated by EMJB's MyInfo.tap on 29/12/18
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Bundy
Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 11:26 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 29 May 2006 Posts: 151
Geoff Bacon wrote:

He can then boot without MyStuff and check that all appears well. If it then fails when MS is started, that implies that it's config files are knackerd.


Thanks for your advice. You've given me a lot of things to try and some hope that I can fix this.

I did previously try booting without MyStuff, i.e., holding 0 down while booting, but still did not get past the reset message.

I did manage to see my taps on the disk via Altair, even while the reset message was displaying, but did not think to look at the recordings. I will try this. The last programme to record, immediately before my problems first started, was from Radio 4 extra. When this was called Radio 7, I several times had trouble recording from it, so I wonder if this recording is corrupt and the cause of my problems. If I can see it via Altair then I can try to copy it to my laptop hard drive to check if it is corrupt. If so, then I could delete it from the toppy and see if this helps.

I'm not able to try any of these fixes at the moment. Next week I'll have time to do the easy tests you suggest, but I won't have time to dismantle the toppy for a couple of weeks. So it will be a while before I can complete your full programme of tests. I'll certainly broadcast the results to this forum when I do.

Thanks

_________________
TF5810, IA On, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.5; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; MyInfo B5.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 5/12/13
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Bundy
Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:29 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 29 May 2006 Posts: 151
alan_m wrote:

If switching on from the mains leave the power off for at least 2 minutes.

Exactly what is happening? What front panel indications are you getting when you boot up?



I've just got back from a 3 day trip during which I left the toppy switched off at the mains. I tried to download the recommended 5810 firmware, switching on from the mains, but got the 'rest' message again. Before this came up I got the 'verifying files and folder's message. I then left it switched off for another 3 mins and tried to download the EmptySettings firmware instead, but with exactly the same result, including the 'verifying files and folders' message before the 'reset' one.

As the toppy booted up, it went through the usual loading/run sequence and then claimed to be on BBC 1.

I successfully connected to the toppy via Altair to ensure that the USB connection was working.

Thanks for your suggestions. I hope this provides some useful diagnostic information for someone, as I'm completely clueless and this point.

_________________
TF5810, IA On, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.5; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; MyInfo B5.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 5/12/13
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Bundy
Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:41 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 29 May 2006 Posts: 151
Geoff Bacon wrote:

I can't see any posts indicating that he has got past this dialogue.


Correct. When I started this post, I only had the problem of all timers being marked as clashing, but once the 'reset' message started appearing, I've not been able to get past it.

Geoff Bacon wrote:

I believe that disconnecting the disk will allow him to bypass this point and download EmptySettings


I've been able to view all my recordings via Altair. I copied a couple of the most recent ones to a temp file on my laptop and then deleted them from the toppy in case they were corrupted, but this has made no difference. I assume that as I can read and delete from the toppy disk, that it can't be too knackered, but let me know if this is too optimistic a conclusion.

Geoff Bacon wrote:


That is why I suggested trying tapless before removing the disk. Assuming he can boot tapless, he can do a native scan and this will erase any timers.
He can then boot without MyStuff and check that all appears well. If it then fails when MS is started, that implies that it's config files are knackerd.

The rest of my post was based on the disk not being usable.

Anway, what we really need is more info from the op about the state of the toppy



It's too late now to start what for me is a major job tonight, but I'll get to it asap. Before this, it would be nice if you confirm that you still suspect the disk after the apparently positive tests reported above.

Thanks.

_________________
TF5810, IA On, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.5; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; MyInfo B5.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 5/12/13
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Bundy
Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:49 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 29 May 2006 Posts: 151
PS _ forgot to mention that I found a file called ~FireBirdLib.tmp~ among the recordings. I also archived this on my laptop and deleted it from the toppy. Any idea what it is? I've not seen anything like it before.

_________________
TF5810, IA On, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.5; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; MyInfo B5.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 5/12/13
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juwlz
Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 12:04 am Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 12 Aug 2005 Posts: 10802 Location: Wokingham, Berkshire (Hannington transmitter)
You could try disconnecting the hard drive and installing EmptySettings. That might get you past the immediate problem.

Once you hook up the drive again, if it still appears to be corrupt, you'll need to install TopfHDRW on a PC, take the drive out of the Toppy, and hook it up directly to the PC (e.g. using a caddy). That should allow you to fix any drive corruptions.

Firebirdlib is used by a number of TAPs. I'm not sure what the temp file is though.

Julie

_________________
5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+BmC0CfCtFsIMPePsR3UUuUxZ
5810, TS On, F/W: F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 +BmCfCtFsR3Z
MyStuff info; Help!; Reference
Harmony 885 remote. Sig date 8 April 2012
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