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alan_m
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:19 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 18 Oct 2006 Posts: 3523
100949football wrote:

Hi Alan, you deserve a stiff drink after this...........me too!
"chunkywizard" will not read on the Mac - no application programme to open it.


Sorry if this a duplicate reply but the Toppy site seems to be timing out at the moment (21:17 Sunday)

We seem to be slightly at cross purposes here Smile

I was under the impression that you had abandoned ToFi to install the firmware and we were going down the alternative method of installing firmware using the HDFW TAP running on your Toppy.

After "installing" HDFW TAP on your Toppy, which you have achieved, all you then have to do is to transfer the new Toppy firmware file to the "Program file/HDFW_firmware" folder.

The first link I gave in the previous post http://www.toppy.org.uk/~chunkywizard/Firmware/Recommended_5800.tfd is the firmware file

You do not open this on you computer. You simply transfer this file to your Toppy using MPEG Streamclip in the similar way that you originally transferred the HDFW TAP file (but the destination folder on the Toppy is
"Program file/HDFW_firmware"

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Ex Toppy 5800 user - now migrated to Extrend ET10000 Enigma 2 box with 2 terrestrial and 2 satellite tuners
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100949football
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:33 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 16 Apr 2006 Posts: 40 Location: Falkirk, scotland
alan_m wrote:
100949football wrote:

Hi Alan, you deserve a stiff drink after this...........me too!
"chunkywizard" will not read on the Mac - no application programme to open it.


Sorry if this a duplicate reply but the Toppy site seems to be timing out at the moment (21:17 Sunday)

We seem to be slightly at cross purposes here Smile

I was under the impression that you had abandoned ToFi to install the firmware and we were going down the alternative method of installing firmware using the HDFW TAP running on your Toppy.

After "installing" HDFW TAP on your Toppy, which you have achieved, all you then have to do is to transfer the new Toppy firmware file to the "Program file/HDFW_firmware" folder.

The first link I gave in the previous post http://www.toppy.org.uk/~chunkywizard/Firmware/Recommended_5800.tfd is the firmware file

You do not open this on you computer. You simply transfer this file to your Toppy using MPEG Streamclip in the similar way that you originally transferred the HDFW TAP file (but the destination folder on the Toppy is
"Program file/HDFW_firmware"


Hi mate, so sorry my head is starting to scramble........I have the "chunkywizard" file in my downloads box.....how do I get it from there into the MPEG-Streamclip Altair Files box containing the "programme files" with HDFW-Firmware folder there?
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alan_m
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:42 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 18 Oct 2006 Posts: 3523
100949football wrote:


Hi mate, so sorry my head is starting to scramble........I have the "chunkywizard" file in my downloads box.....how do I get it from there into the MPEG-Streamclip Altair Files box containing the "programme files" with HDFW-Firmware folder there?


That I don't know as I don't have a MAC or use MPEG Steamclip

Assumption:

Cannot you just highlight the file name and click and drag (copy/paste) it into the Altair Files box? Or.. if MPEG Straemclip is showing a box with the files on your Toppy cannot you just click and drag (copy/paste) from one part of your computers hard disk into the Toppy box? All you are attempting to do is just move a file on your own computer and then move it to the Toppy.

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100949football
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:48 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 16 Apr 2006 Posts: 40 Location: Falkirk, scotland
alan_m wrote:
100949football wrote:


Hi mate, so sorry my head is starting to scramble........I have the "chunkywizard" file in my downloads box.....how do I get it from there into the MPEG-Streamclip Altair Files box containing the "programme files" with HDFW-Firmware folder there?


That I don't know as I don't have a MAC or use MPEG Steamclip

Assumption:

Cannot you just highlight the file name and click and drag (copy/paste) it into the Altair Files box? Or.. if MPEG Straemclip is showing a box with the files on your Toppy cannot you just click and drag (copy/paste) from one part of your computers hard disk into the Toppy box? All you are attempting to do is just move a file on your own computer and then move it to the Toppy.


I simply "uploaded" that from my "downloads" (with some trepidation)and it has gone into the "programme files HDFW Firmware so let's see what happens when I go back to my "toy-room" - projector.....back soon with hopefully good news.
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100949football
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 10:24 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 16 Apr 2006 Posts: 40 Location: Falkirk, scotland
100949football wrote:
alan_m wrote:
100949football wrote:


Hi mate, so sorry my head is starting to scramble........I have the "chunkywizard" file in my downloads box.....how do I get it from there into the MPEG-Streamclip Altair Files box containing the "programme files" with HDFW-Firmware folder there?


That I don't know as I don't have a MAC or use MPEG Steamclip

Assumption:

Cannot you just highlight the file name and click and drag (copy/paste) it into the Altair Files box? Or.. if MPEG Straemclip is showing a box with the files on your Toppy cannot you just click and drag (copy/paste) from one part of your computers hard disk into the Toppy box? All you are attempting to do is just move a file on your own computer and then move it to the Toppy.


I simply "uploaded" that from my "downloads" (with some trepidation)and it has gone into the "programme files HDFW Firmware so let's see what happens when I go back to my "toy-room" - projector.....back soon with hopefully good news.



Well...........good news and bad news.


Good News: Firmware updated successfully
Device version now 5.3.35 (was 5.3.33)
Software Version now 5.13.65T (was 5.12.8Cool
Last update Oct 10, 2009 (was July 05, 2006)

Bad News:

Did factory reset and full rescan - still my original problem. Only getting 10 BBC TV Channels and 13 BBC radio channels nothing else.
Very strange as I was getting multitudes of channels only a few days ago (just had a thought - we had digital switchover on 1st June!!!!!)
That shouldn't have made any difference would it?
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Geoff Bacon
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 10:35 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 4472
Have you done a factory reset and retune? (probably yes but this thread is getting long!)

Also, in you have a digital TV (rather than analogue), can you receive other channels on it (if it gets the same channels as the toppy, you probably have an aerial issue)

Geoff

_________________
TopManager program
TF5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+EvEzPfUUuZ
TAPs: PcControl B1.4; StopExit v1.01; PruneEPG 1.0; fsSave 1.1; QuickJump 1.72; SecCache (UK) v0.4; EIT Sub (Game) v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.6; Bookmark 3.0; Extend v1.7; Font Manager 1.0d; MyInfo B5.6; MHEG On/Off A3;
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alan_m
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 11:05 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 18 Oct 2006 Posts: 3523
100949football wrote:

Good News: Firmware updated successfully
Device version now 5.3.35 (was 5.3.33)
Software Version now 5.13.65T (was 5.12.8Cool
Last update Oct 10, 2009 (was July 05, 2006)


That is the first hurdle and despite the "bad news" you will have needed to do a firmware update anyway. It may also be worth sorting out the problem(s) on one Toppy before attempting to change the other.

Quote:

Bad News:

Did factory reset and full rescan - still my original problem. Only getting 10 BBC TV Channels and 13 BBC radio channels nothing else.

Very strange as I was getting multitudes of channels only a few days ago (just had a thought - we had digital switchover on 1st June!!!!!)
That shouldn't have made any difference would it?


Did DSO just start on 1st June - in many areas the change happens over many days with all sorts of problem whilst this is happening

Next Steps.

From which transmitter are you getting your signals? Do you know if you are using a main transmitter or a relay transmitter?
If you don't know put your postcode into http://www.wolfbane.com/cgi-bin/tvd.exe? and tell us what it reports.

The broadcaster may/will have changed the frequencies (transmitter channel numbers) at DSO and your aerial may no longer be suitable. This is easily checked if you know the transmitter. However to lose everything other than one MUX is unusual.

There are a couple of TAPs that you can run that will produce diagnostic text files that you can post back here. While they may not solve your lack of channels they could give us a LOT of information about your settings and the state of your reception.

The first is called MyInfo which can be found at:
http://www.tapworld.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=608

This is installed and run on your Toppy in a same/similar way as the HDFW TAP you have already used

Download the MyInfo file and unzip it

From the zip file transfer the following files to "Program Files" on your Toppy using MPEG streamclip
Myinfo.tap
MyInfo.ini
MyInfo.lng
Firmware.dat

Then manually run the MyInfo TAP using just your Toppy, Toppy remote and TV.

A screen of information will appear AND in the background the TAP will write a couple of text files to your Toppy's hard disk. You will find these files in "program files" (maybe in a "log" folder)

Quit the TAP using the exit key on the remote.

Using MPEG Steamclip transfer the two log files back to your computer and post the content of them back here. The files will be called MyInfo Log.txt and Myinfo Channel Data.txt . These files can also be read on your own computer using any text editor/word processor.

The second diagnostic TAP is called Signal Monitor which can be found at:
http://www.tapworld.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=318

Download
Unzip
Transfer the "Signal Monitor.tap" to the Toppy's "Program Files folder
Manually run the TAP.
Wait for the screen to populate with information and then press record on the remote.

Pressing record will create a text log file on the Toppy's hard disk with the same information that was on the screen. Again, the content of this text log file can be posted back here.

_________________
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100949football
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 11:18 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 16 Apr 2006 Posts: 40 Location: Falkirk, scotland
Alan,

I can only sincerely thank you for your time and patience in setting me out on this learning "curve" on the Toppy.
Thank you also to everyone else who tried to help.
I am usually quite "literate" on issues TV so I cannot really understand an aerial signal problem when I have a terrestrial digital tv in our lounge working perfectly ok.
The Toppy in our lounge (working perfectly well prior to DSO) started playing up in that - for whatever reason - I would select BBC1, picture would appear on-screen for about ten seconds then, on it's own accord, change to BBC2. Obviously a "pain when you were setting to record.
"No Signal On Tuner 2" was another headache!
I did a factory reset and a channel rescan on the lounge Toppy a few minutes ago and it now appears that all these glitches have gone.....weird.

No doubt you'll all from me again

"Lang May Yer Lum Reek"

Scots............ meaning Long May Your Chimney Smoke
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alan_m
Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 11:52 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 18 Oct 2006 Posts: 3523
100949football wrote:

I am usually quite "literate" on issues TV so I cannot really understand an aerial signal problem when I have a terrestrial digital tv in our lounge working perfectly ok.


That says your aerial is OK and suitable for post DSO. Lack of channels on other boxes can be as a result of the aerial distribution in your own home and the sensitivity of the tuners in the various boxes. It may be counter intuitive but an increase in signal strength at the transmitter, which happens at DSO, can swamp the front end of a sensitive tuner and result in a loss of channels. i.e. too much signal. Running the Signal monitor TAP on both boxes and reporting the the results back here could give some clues if too much signal is a problem. If this is the cause of the problem a simple solution of using an in-line 10db to 20db attenuator may cure the problem. http://www.beststuff.co.uk/store/TV-Attenuator.htm

How is your aerial distributed to your TV and the two Toppy's?

If you have some amplification in the aerial distribution (masthead amp, aerial booster etc.) some of this amplification may no longer be necessary.

Quote:

The Toppy in our lounge (working perfectly well prior to DSO) started playing up in that - for whatever reason - I would select BBC1, picture would appear on-screen for about ten seconds then, on it's own accord, change to BBC2. Obviously a "pain when you were setting to record.
"No Signal On Tuner 2" was another headache!
I did a factory reset and a channel rescan on the lounge Toppy a few minutes ago and it now appears that all these glitches have gone.....weird.


DSO may have taken many days and on one of your boxes you may have done a rescan whilst the broadcasters were still changing things at the transmitter or you previous set-up was only valid for a few hours or so

Irrespective of your apparently working Toppy you still need to check quite a few things to make it reliable.

You need to update both Toppy to the recommended firmware or you are likely to find that the box running the older firmware will fail during recording.

Have you still got channels numbed 1000+?

You also have to ensure that the Toppy is not getting duplicate channels from multiple transmitters which can be a common occurrence now that the power on all transmitters is increasing as analogue is switched off. The Toppy is rather intolerant of duplicate channels.

It is recommended that after a scan you delete all the unwanted dross channels - pay, shopping, porn, radio etc to a sensible total of 40 or 50. This can improve the reliability of your Toppy.

The MyInfo TAP identifies many of the problems that can make your Toppy unreliable

I recommend that you:
Update the firmware on both Toppys
Swap the one that is only seeing the 10 BBC channels with the one that now has all channels to see if the problem swaps with the position in your house.
Run MyInfo and Signal Monitor on both Toppys and post the results back here for advice.

Even if you don't want to change your Toppy too much there are a couple of TAPs that can be run automatically in the background on your Toppy that can improve it's reliability. These are easy to install as a fit and forget.

_________________
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100949football
Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:41 pm Reply with quote
Regular contributor Joined: 16 Apr 2006 Posts: 40 Location: Falkirk, scotland
Hi Alan,
thank you ever so for all the help you gave me.
Final one on the Toppy's.......as you know I now have Toppy 2 all firmwared up.
Can I simply connect Toppy 1 and Toppy 2 to transfer (update Toppy 1) firmware between them?
Can this be done via good old scart or is it better via the "printer-type" connections?
Re the channel losses - I hate to be sheepish but, we had high wind only last week and it would appear the aerial serving Toppy 2 has had it's direction altered and is somewhat pointing into the ground around 20 yards from our house - definitely NOT a guarantee of good signal. So I'll be up on the ladder shortly - Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed
This same aerial is serving a kitchen digital tv perfectly ok though but I suspect the cable travel to Toppy 2 allied to the aerial direction is the root of that problem.
Toppy 1 appears to be ok now so I can only assume that was down to DSO.
I DO want to upgrade the firmware on Toppy 1 though. After all the shenanigans of yesterday I am so hoping I can simply do a firmware transfer from Toppy 2 to Toppy 1.

Thanks to everyone who helped - in particular Alan.
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juwlz
Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:47 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 12 Aug 2005 Posts: 10802 Location: Wokingham, Berkshire (Hannington transmitter)
No, you can't transfer anything directly from one Toppy to another. But now you've got the process sussed, it'll be much easier to repeat it on the second one Wink

Julie

_________________
5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+BmC0CfCtFsIMPePsR3UUuUxZ
5810, TS On, F/W: F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 +BmCfCtFsR3Z
MyStuff info; Help!; Reference
Harmony 885 remote. Sig date 8 April 2012
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ccs
Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:52 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 30 Oct 2007 Posts: 2620
juwlz wrote:
No, you can't transfer anything directly from one Toppy to another. But now you've got the process sussed, it'll be much easier to repeat it on the second one Wink

Julie
Actually, you can, but I agree it would be easier to repeat the upgrade on the second toppy rather than try something new.

edit: forget that ....... only applies to 2x5810's Smile

edit(again): looks like it can be done on 5800's as well. Smile


Last edited by ccs on Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:34 pm; edited 1 time in total

_________________
TF5810, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -FmXl+CtEzIScVdZ
TAPs: EIT Sub v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MPDisplayLITE V1.2; MyInfo B5.6; SecCache (UK) v0.4; Extend v1.7; MyStuff 6.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 20/10/14
ccsx
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juwlz
Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 6:03 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 12 Aug 2005 Posts: 10802 Location: Wokingham, Berkshire (Hannington transmitter)
ccs wrote:
juwlz wrote:
No, you can't transfer anything directly from one Toppy to another.
Actually, you can
Without involving any sort of computer? How? (I'm intrigued.)

Julie

_________________
5800, TS On, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -Sy+BmC0CfCtFsIMPePsR3UUuUxZ
5810, TS On, F/W: F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 +BmCfCtFsR3Z
MyStuff info; Help!; Reference
Harmony 885 remote. Sig date 8 April 2012
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billmars
Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 7:46 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 17 Sep 2005 Posts: 761
Quote:
Transfer firmware

The Transfer firmware option is used to transfer the software that controls your PVR ? the Firmware ? to another TF5800 PVR, using a cable to link the two units via their serial ports. It is intended for advanced users only, and the recommended way to update the firmware on a PVR is via a USB connection to your computer or an over the air broadcast, as described in section 6, Advanced Features, Firmware updates.


-from the manual - never tried it, nor heard of anyone using this method.

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Firmware
5800 Samsung 1Tb Autostart TAPs: Extend 1.7;TSRCommander 1.5;TF5000 Display 1.53;EPG2MEI 0.95;MyStuff 6.6;QuickJump 1.72;Power Down 0.75;SecCache 0.4;TSSaver 0.4;MHEG Control B2;eit_sub_sng 0.6 Transmitter: Belmont Extras: as2mei (via NSLU2)
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ccs
Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 7:54 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 30 Oct 2007 Posts: 2620
juwlz wrote:
ccs wrote:
juwlz wrote:
No, you can't transfer anything directly from one Toppy to another.
Actually, you can
Without involving any sort of computer? How? (I'm intrigued.)

Julie
The 5810 manual says.....................

6.4 Copy Firmware and Settings to Another System
If you have more than one TF 5810 PVRt, you can copy a
firmware or Settings between them by connecting a RS-232
cable .
6.4.1 Copy Firmware to Another System
To copy a firmware from one to another, perform the following
steps:
1. Turn off the target digital receiver.
2. Plug one end of a RS-232 cable (9 pin D-sub cable) into the
RS-232 port on the digital receiver, and the other end into
the matching port on the other digital receiver.
3. Turn on the source digital receiver if not already on.
4. Press the MENU button to display the PVR?s main menu,
and then select Installation and Transfer firmware. On the
Installation menu, select Copy firmware to another system
menu. Then you?ll be asked for confirmation; select ?Yes?.
5. Turn on the target digital receiver to start the firmware transfer.
6. Aprogress bar appears showing the progress of the firmware
transfer.
7. Restart the target digital receiver when the firmware transfer
is complete.
6.4.2 Copy Settings to Another System
You can also copy settings by connecting a RS-232 cable. When
you do this, some settings are copied such as services list, favorites
lists and preference settings.
To copy a Settings from one to another system, perform the
following steps:
1. Plug one end of a RS-232 cable (9 pin D-sub cable) into the
RS-232 port on the digital receiver, and the other end into
the matching port on the other digital receiver.
2. Turn on the source digital receiver.
3. Press the MENU button to display the PVR?s main menu,
and then select Installation and Transfer firmware. On the
Transfer firmware menu, select Copy settings to another
system menu. Then you?ll be asked for confirmation; select
?Yes?.
4. To start the data transfer, turn on the target digital receiver.
5. A progress bar appears showing the progress of the data
transfer.
6. Restart the target digital receiver when the data transfer is
complete.

I couldn't find any reference to this in the 5800 manual.

_________________
TF5810, F/W: MS6 Recommended F/W 12/9/2009 -FmXl+CtEzIScVdZ
TAPs: EIT Sub v0.6; EPG2MEI v0.96; MPDisplayLITE V1.2; MyInfo B5.6; SecCache (UK) v0.4; Extend v1.7; MyStuff 6.6;
Sig generated by MyInfo on 20/10/14
ccsx
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