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warwick
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:52 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 29 Apr 2005 Posts: 3
Well it arrived today, and i'm having problems - caused in no small part due to the terrible instruction manual.

As someone who's owned tivo and sky+ - there are some things that the TF5800PVR does that I simply can't understand. However, a little more time, and perhaps some TAPs will solve this.

HOWEVER - as I type I'm timer recording Jonathan Ross - and yet I cannot find a way to playback this program from the beginning. Programs recorded earlier in the evening are in my "recorded services" list, as is Jonathan Ross - but try as I might it will only start playing from live - I can't make it start from the beginning.

Can anyone help.
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Sulli
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:56 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 28 Mar 2005 Posts: 250 Location: Manchester
Well this is probably to late for you now.

But in future if you want to chase play. Press play to bring up the progress bar. Then scroll to the left as far as you want.
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Darkmatter
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:59 pm Reply with quote
Forum moderator Joined: 21 Mar 2005 Posts: 1237
Yes, that's correct. Whilst the record is in progress the Toppy will just switch to the channel it's recording from. Just press, and hold down the << key - the progress bar will pop up, and time marker will move rapidly to the start of the programme.
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Richard46
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 9:38 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 31 Mar 2005 Posts: 1586 Location: Forest Gate East London
warwick wrote:
(,,,)
but try as I might it will only start playing from live - I can't make it start from the beginning.

Can anyone help.


I can understand why this confused you; the start is the obvious place to start; certainly no one would ever want to watch a recording from the end Confused .
It is not just the inconvenience of rewinding that I find irksome. e.g. I often chase a live recording to watch longer sporting events e.g. F1 (sad I know). By the time I have rewound it will be obvious who is in front etc. If I start during the award ceremony; thats it; 2 hours of viewing ruined. I have ended up trying to rewind with vol down and without looking at the screen; which is not easy, especially if a command does not register first time.
While I am at it it gets worse. During playback of a live recording things work differently than during normal playback. e.g. pressing 1 takes you to live channel 1 not to 1% of the recording. pressing stop asks you if you want to stop the recording not the playback.
On my Pace Twin one press of stop just stops playback. Much more consistent as it replicates what happens during normal playback.
Live playback on the Toppy is one of those things I know is going to be difficult to explain to my wife if and when it ever actually gets moved out of my den and into the front room.

Anyway rant over; I love most aspects of the Toppy and would not get rid of it.
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warwick
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 10:17 am Reply with quote
Joined: 29 Apr 2005 Posts: 3
I've now been experimenting further, and i'm really not impressed.

What possible reason would someone have to start watching a program from live, rather than the beginning. If you "arrive home" and want to watch live you can - but realistically who is going to want to do this, rather than watch a program that's already recording from the beginning.

Surely the whole point of having a PVR is that you don't have to worry about time and schedules - not being able to watch from the beginning is a major flaw as far as I can see.

I use a PVR for 2 things - to record shows for later playback, but i'm also quite a heavy "chase play" user - speed watching shows - scanning through the commercials and slow bits - with this machine it's going to take me 15 minutes to rewind a show that's 45 minutes in - meaning that it will probably take as long to just watch it live.

After less than 24 hours of use, I consider the toppy to be a seriously flawed product - it's major issue seems to be that the designers/programmers seem confused as to the difference between the way it records programs, and the way it handles live TV/instant rewind. They don't seem to understand that these are not the same thing, and so need to be handled differently.

I decided on this machine because I liked the idea of USB connectivity and TAPs - but if they can't get the basic PVR functions right - i'm going to find it annoys me in day to day use.

This machine is going back - can anyone make another recommendation - I considered the Humax, which gets great reviews, but thought i'd prefer a twin tuner, and so considered the Panasonic, but didn't buy due to a lot of bad feedback.

Is the pace twin as bad as they say it is ?

Any other suggestions ???

Regards,
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nwhitfield
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 10:34 am Reply with quote
Site Admin Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 9579
I don't know about other machines, but depending on where you bought your Toppy from, and how long you have to decide whether or not to return it, I would say it might be worth waiting to see whether any of your issues are addressed by the update in early May.

I hope to have more details about it early next week, though of course if you only have 7 days to decide, that's not necessarily much help.

Nigel.
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Richard46
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 10:41 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 31 Mar 2005 Posts: 1586 Location: Forest Gate East London
warwick wrote:
(,,,)
Surely the whole point of having a PVR is that you don't have to worry about time and schedules - not being able to watch from the beginning is a major flaw as far as I can see.

I use a PVR for 2 things - to record shows for later playback, but i'm also quite a heavy "chase play" user - speed watching shows - scanning through the commercials and slow bits - with this machine it's going to take me 15 minutes to rewind a show that's 45 minutes in - meaning that it will probably take as long to just watch it live.
(,,,)


Hang on Warwick; its a nuisence but it is not as bad as that, to get back to the begining of a 'live' recording does only take a second or two however long the recording is.
e.g. play the recording from the archive; press play so that the yellow bar comes up across the top of the screen and then hold down rewind button until the marker goes all the way to the left; release button and you are at the start. What is currently recording stays on screen until you let go.
Agree it is very irritating that you have to do anything at all to get to the start of the recording but it sounds like you have only found the 3x rewind.
Hope this further explanation helps.
BTW the Pace Twin is not produced any longer it does have a more logical interface but the hardware is very limited (10 hours recording) and it is not as stable as the Toppy. There are alternatives but despite its quirks I still think the Toppy has most potential and perhaps spending a day or two with it might sort out some of your problems with it.

Richard
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Brava_210
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 10:45 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Apr 2005 Posts: 328 Location: Bristol
I use a PVR for 2 things - to record shows for later playback, but i'm also quite a heavy "chase play" user - speed watching shows - scanning through the commercials and slow bits - with this machine it's going to take me 15 minutes to rewind a show that's 45 minutes in - meaning that it will probably take as long to just watch it live

reply..

i have tried all current pvr's i also have had a pace twin for 2 years
nothing will or does compare to the twin for ease of use.
the only other pvr that chase plays like the twin is the panasonic, but it is a poor product.
i had the same reservations about the chaseplay as well but i have found its reliability,hdd size,record 2 watch 3rd features out weigh its shortfalls,

plus i could never rely on the pace to record succesfully now i can.....
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warwick
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 11:46 am Reply with quote
Joined: 29 Apr 2005 Posts: 3
Your right - I had only discovered the x3 rewind speed - but this goes back to the point I made initially - the manual is terrible - offering bad english, and with masses of important information missing. How much other stuff do I not know about ?

I'm also not a fan of the channel changing TV guide (but people seem to really rate JAG's tap - does anyone know if it's OK on a UK machine) and I find the rewind speeds frustrating - I read that there is a TAP for this too but I can't remember what it's called.

I can't believe that there isn't a TAP which does a better job of managing recordings - playing programs which are still recording from the beginning (can anyone give me a reason why it needs to work the way it does) and resuming playback from where you left off - rather than the beginning again.

As I mentioned previously, I've used tivo in the past - and while I love the software it was very slow, and didn't intergrate with sky well, so when Sky started to offer dual recording I took the plunge and switched. I still use sky+ now, and while the functionality isn't as good as Tivo, the ease of use, dual recording and speed means it suits me down to the ground.

Toppy is simply an option to deal with program clashes on my sky+, and also an trial to see if I can replace my sky+ - as now that E4 is going to freeview - I'm seriously considering giving up paying 29.50 a month to watch a handful of shows.

I'd be perfectly happy with Sky+ functionality - which lets face it is hardly state of the art - but don't seem to be able to find it in a freeview box.
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Sulli
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 12:03 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 28 Mar 2005 Posts: 250 Location: Manchester
warwick wrote:
I'm also not a fan of the channel changing TV guide (but people seem to really rate JAG's tap - does anyone know if it's OK on a UK machine)


JAGs is a really good alternative but at the moment the author hasn't released the UK version. But it shouldn't be long before its out.
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odvdveer
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 4:15 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 28 Mar 2005 Posts: 121 Location: Netherlands
Quote:
I find the rewind speeds frustrating - I read that there is a TAP for this too but I can't remember what it's called.

I can't believe that there isn't a TAP which does a better job of managing recordings - playing programs which are still recording from the beginning (can anyone give me a reason why it needs to work the way it

There are 2 TAP's for that, but I believe that neither of them is adapted for the UK yet. They are ProgressBarKeys and Improbox. Bot have skipping options and can jump directly to the beginning of a recording program when you select it from the playlist. If you are up to it you could try writing your own TAP based on the sourcecode off the earlier versions of these TAP's (you used to get the sourcecode with the TAP's)

Quote:
resuming playback from where you left off - rather than the beginning again

This is covered by ProgressBarKeys, but you'll need bookmarks for that. Check the threads about firmware updates for the 5800 for more information on getting bookmarks in your firmware.


Olga

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Topfield 5000pvr, firmware 13.9.05p
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