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<  Satellite receivers, cable boxes and PVRs  ~  Humax (Foxsat) Freesat HD PVR 320Gb

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Vindictor
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:09 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Cornwall
I don't suppose this HDR comes with the required loopthrough cables for those of us stuck with a single LNB output?

I'm still iffing and umming about getting this.
I've never been so indecisive in my life!

On the one hand, I really fancy one, and on the other hand I feel I'll be disappointed, as I only want it in addition to the Toppy 5800, for the HD channels mainly. I also keep thinking that if I wait, then better PVRs may come along, maybe even a decent Topfield one... or that ITV seem to be claiming that 50% of the UK should be able to receive ITV-HD via Freeview in 2010 for the Football, so maybe there'll be Toppy Freeview HD PVRs available soon if I wait?

Of course, as with all things tech, you can wait forever for newer and better models of kit to come out.

Still, I was just about to order this Foxsat HDR, and it suddenly occurred to me that I don't know if it comes with the loopthrough LNB cable.

If I don't have one, will I be severely restricted?
Will I still be able to watch and record BBC-HD and ITV-HD, as well as other channels, even if only one at a time? I can at least fall back on the Toppy for viewing other channels while the Foxsat box is recording.

Vin.

_________________
Toppy:TF5800 F/W:1365BfBqCeCyEcErEsFGmHMhNfPPcPfRRpSSrT2UXpXw
TAPs: Movie Progress V3.2 - Jag's EPG v3.0 Beta 2 (Full Version) - UK Timers v1.2 - DescriptionExtender 2.1 - mcgCYRResume V1.0 - Power Manager v2.0 - MyInfo A4
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noncom
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:24 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 01 Sep 2006 Posts: 542
DX wrote:
Vindictor wrote:
Getting BBC-HD files off really is something I'd like to be able to do. I've seen BBC-HD rips on the internet, like the latest Torchwood series, which looked great I might add, so the people who did the rips must've got the content copied onto their PCs somehow. I don't believe in this case that they used component cables, as the quality was just so good, so maybe they found a way to bypass the BBC copy protect flag.

I assume they have used a PC based system to record. If you are going to routinely work with BBC HD recordings that might actually be a better route for you than using a PVR then transferring recordings. An HTPC with Windows 7 Media Center will give you a 14 day EPG courtesy of Microsoft, or there are open source projects to use the Freesat EPG.


There's a hush-hush-ish project run by the BBC Research Dept which acts like an iPlayer with no timeout, and the downloads are at full TX quality ie 16-17Mb/s for HD with (as far as I know) no copy protection flags. I suspect someone within the BBC with access to that system is being naughty and putting them on Torrents.

Could be wrong though.

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Vindictor
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:08 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Cornwall
noncom wrote:
DX wrote:
Vindictor wrote:
Getting BBC-HD files off really is something I'd like to be able to do. I've seen BBC-HD rips on the internet, like the latest Torchwood series, which looked great I might add, so the people who did the rips must've got the content copied onto their PCs somehow. I don't believe in this case that they used component cables, as the quality was just so good, so maybe they found a way to bypass the BBC copy protect flag.

I assume they have used a PC based system to record. If you are going to routinely work with BBC HD recordings that might actually be a better route for you than using a PVR then transferring recordings. An HTPC with Windows 7 Media Center will give you a 14 day EPG courtesy of Microsoft, or there are open source projects to use the Freesat EPG.


There's a hush-hush-ish project run by the BBC Research Dept which acts like an iPlayer with no timeout, and the downloads are at full TX quality ie 16-17Mb/s for HD with (as far as I know) no copy protection flags. I suspect someone within the BBC with access to that system is being naughty and putting them on Torrents.

Could be wrong though.


I'd love to get my hands on some of those Wink
My ISP would soon complain if I went for too many.

I happened across the latest Torchwood series, which had been compressed to 1.5gb MKV files, and 720p, yet I was surprised how very good they looked, better than any previous internet MKV rips I'd seen before.

A colleage of mine once got hold of a Premiere-HD rip on the internet of King Kong, that was AVC and full 1080p, and weighed in at 23gb.
Looked pretty good! Wink

Getting stuff of BBC-HD isn't something I'd want to do all that often, but the option to do so now and then would be nice. Like I use my Topfield to copy files over for a family member to borrow on a DVD-RW, if I've recorded something I think they'd like... just trying to retain the same functionality we had with VHS! Wink Or even just to take through to watch in the bedroom.

The eSata caddy idea is interesting, and maybe the possibility to record in non-Freesat mode, just for the odd one off recording now and then. Shame they've introduced this copy protect flag really. It just reduces functionality.

Vin.

_________________
Toppy:TF5800 F/W:1365BfBqCeCyEcErEsFGmHMhNfPPcPfRRpSSrT2UXpXw
TAPs: Movie Progress V3.2 - Jag's EPG v3.0 Beta 2 (Full Version) - UK Timers v1.2 - DescriptionExtender 2.1 - mcgCYRResume V1.0 - Power Manager v2.0 - MyInfo A4
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simonc
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:16 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 12 Apr 2005 Posts: 5639 Location: Cheltenham
Vindictor wrote:
I don't suppose this HDR comes with the required loopthrough cables for those of us stuck with a single LNB output?
IIRC it doesn't work like terrestrial. The LNB is an active component that switches mode on command from the STB depending on what multiplex you're viewing.
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Vindictor
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:23 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Cornwall
simonc wrote:
Vindictor wrote:
I don't suppose this HDR comes with the required loopthrough cables for those of us stuck with a single LNB output?
IIRC it doesn't work like terrestrial. The LNB is an active component that switches mode on command from the STB depending on what multiplex you're viewing.


Yeah mate, I do realise that, but with the Humax I've been reading about the fact it does have a loopthrough option, to partially provide the ability to record multiple channels at once, for those users with just one LNB connection.

It's not as good as two proper connections, but it's better than just one normal one. It's one of the features of the Humax.

Vin.

EDIT: I don't suppose anybody has any current Dixon's vouchers? Wink A nice bit of discount could always sway me!

_________________
Toppy:TF5800 F/W:1365BfBqCeCyEcErEsFGmHMhNfPPcPfRRpSSrT2UXpXw
TAPs: Movie Progress V3.2 - Jag's EPG v3.0 Beta 2 (Full Version) - UK Timers v1.2 - DescriptionExtender 2.1 - mcgCYRResume V1.0 - Power Manager v2.0 - MyInfo A4
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Wildoat
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:56 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 18 Apr 2005 Posts: 532 Location: Diss / Tacolneston Transmitter
I only have 1 LNB connected and have loop through - works well. You dont have access to all channels when you are recording something (varies with the channel u are recording) but you have access to quite a few - a real win over my old PACE sky box where I could only watch 1 channel.

W

PS Had the odd missed recording and you cannot delete a recording if you are recording something (irritating) but otherwise very pleased with it.

_________________
TAPS: TF5000 Display : MyStuff : epg2mei : Extend : FontManager : seccacheUK : eit_sub_sng : SDS : MhegOnOff.
Topfield Model: TF5800PVR Silver (400GB UpGrade) - Firmware version: 5.13.65 Heavily Patched!.

Networked via Homeplug: Asus WL-500GX + Olegs firmware 1.9.2.7-7g + ftpd-topfield 0.7.4.
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Vindictor
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 10:00 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Cornwall
Wildoat wrote:
I only have 1 LNB connected and have loop through - works well. You dont have access to all channels when you are recording something (varies with the channel u are recording) but you have access to quite a few - a real win over my old PACE sky box where I could only watch 1 channel.

W

PS Had the odd missed recording and you cannot delete a recording if you are recording something (irritating) but otherwise very pleased with it.

Thanks for your post.

I've been putting it off and putting it off, but that burning desire to have a new toy to play with isn't dissipating, so I think I may order one tomorrow. I'm just concerned it won't get much use, as the Toppy is my main PVR, but at least I will be able to watch those few things on BBC-HD once or twice a week that appeal. So far on the ITV-HD schedule page, I've seen nothing of interest at all lol Seems to be OK if you like The Bill though. Shame I missed those Trevor McDonald in the Caribbean, I bet that looked good in HD.

Anyway, the question being, did it come with the loopthrough cable? Also have you updated your firmware since owning it?

Also, with one LNB, are you able to record both BBC-HD and ITV-HD at the same time? These are the main two channels I'll be buying the box for, but I'm also not expecting miracles.

Vin.

EDIT: and thanks to this site for allowing this discussion. I'm aware it's a Topfield forum really, so I really appreciate being able to ask all these questions in here. Ideally, I would be buying a Topfield Freesat box, pretty much a DVB-S HD version of the 5800 if it were possible, taps and all... but sadly, seeing as it isn't, this Humax appears to be the next best thing. So thanks again for this thread.

EDIT: OK, I've caved in and ordered one. I guess it won't come with the loopthrough cable, and I don't have one here, but I guess it'll work, at least on one channel at a time, until I can get one sorted. I'm still a little nervous about my purchase, that's quite a lot of money for me, so I hope I like it! Smile Thanks again to all previous posters for your help.

_________________
Toppy:TF5800 F/W:1365BfBqCeCyEcErEsFGmHMhNfPPcPfRRpSSrT2UXpXw
TAPs: Movie Progress V3.2 - Jag's EPG v3.0 Beta 2 (Full Version) - UK Timers v1.2 - DescriptionExtender 2.1 - mcgCYRResume V1.0 - Power Manager v2.0 - MyInfo A4
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Wildoat
Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 7:01 am Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 18 Apr 2005 Posts: 532 Location: Diss / Tacolneston Transmitter
Hi,

Can confirm that it did NOT come with a loop through cable - I bought one off Amazon when I ordered the unit from them:

This is what I ordered: 1 of 1 Metre Gold Plated F-Type Male to Male Satellite Coaxial Cable by Cable Mountain.

Re recording BBC1 HD and ITV HD at the same time I cannot confirm as whilst I have had my unit I have not seeen anything on ITV HD. Interestingly BBC HD shows as a channel (108 on my unit) but ITV HD doesn't - I believe you access ITV HD by pressing red button which I havnt done - if I was a betting man I would assume you cant.

I havnt updated firmware as mine was delivered with version .03 (the latest you can download from Humax site is .02) - apparently an update is expected anytime. Updates are either over the air or you can download and use a USB stick

Good luck.

W

_________________
TAPS: TF5000 Display : MyStuff : epg2mei : Extend : FontManager : seccacheUK : eit_sub_sng : SDS : MhegOnOff.
Topfield Model: TF5800PVR Silver (400GB UpGrade) - Firmware version: 5.13.65 Heavily Patched!.

Networked via Homeplug: Asus WL-500GX + Olegs firmware 1.9.2.7-7g + ftpd-topfield 0.7.4.
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Vindictor
Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 10:59 am Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Cornwall
Wildoat wrote:
Hi,

Can confirm that it did NOT come with a loop through cable - I bought one off Amazon when I ordered the unit from them:

This is what I ordered: 1 of 1 Metre Gold Plated F-Type Male to Male Satellite Coaxial Cable by Cable Mountain.

Re recording BBC1 HD and ITV HD at the same time I cannot confirm as whilst I have had my unit I have not seeen anything on ITV HD. Interestingly BBC HD shows as a channel (108 on my unit) but ITV HD doesn't - I believe you access ITV HD by pressing red button which I havnt done - if I was a betting man I would assume you cant.

I havnt updated firmware as mine was delivered with version .03 (the latest you can download from Humax site is .02) - apparently an update is expected anytime. Updates are either over the air or you can download and use a USB stick

Good luck.

W


Hi there, and thanks for your tip.
To save hassle, and for the sake of a few quid, I've ordered the same loopthrough cable, so thanks again for posting.

Thanks also for letting me know that the firmware can be updated from a USB device. That's great to know.

As for ITV-HD, you're correct, from everything I've read, when a show is on ITV1 that's also available in HD, you press the red button.
I've also read in this very thread, that if you set a timer, and a HD version of the show is available, the Humax will give you the option to record the HD version.

There's not a lot on ITV-HD at the moment. Not even every day... but there are a few films on during the weekend I think, and episodes of The Bill are in HD.

If you look here

http://www.freesat.co.uk/index.php?page=whatson.HDschedule

you can use the calander to the left to see what's on.
You'll see that BBC-HD has content every evening from 4pm onwards, and ITV-HD has the odd show now and then... so if you want to try it out, maybe set a timer for one of these shows, and see if your Humax gives the option to record in HD, and then you can see it for yourself.

I certainly hope this works, now that I've taken the plunge and ordered the PVR myself!!

Vin.

EDIT: By the way, if you look at this coming Saturday schedule, you'll see that there are two HD films on ITV-HD, which may be worth checking out, to see the quality of it, if nothing else. Assuming my box is here and set up by then, I'll give them a try.


Full Size: http://i25.tinypic.com/vh3mfn.jpg

_________________
Toppy:TF5800 F/W:1365BfBqCeCyEcErEsFGmHMhNfPPcPfRRpSSrT2UXpXw
TAPs: Movie Progress V3.2 - Jag's EPG v3.0 Beta 2 (Full Version) - UK Timers v1.2 - DescriptionExtender 2.1 - mcgCYRResume V1.0 - Power Manager v2.0 - MyInfo A4
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Barry
Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:16 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 22 May 2005 Posts: 122 Location: South West
As I mentioned earlier single cable updating was fixed in version 1.00.02 software, and provided a link to a useful programme you can use to determine what you can record and watch with single cable.

You would be extermely unlucky to receive a unit with an earlier version now.

You might also be interested in this link which has many screenshots:

http://foxsat-hdr.wikispaces.com/Review+Links
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Vindictor
Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:53 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Cornwall
Barry wrote:
As I mentioned earlier single cable updating was fixed in version 1.00.02 software, and provided a link to a useful programme you can use to determine what you can record and watch with single cable.

You would be extermely unlucky to receive a unit with an earlier version now.

You might also be interested in this link which has many screenshots:

http://foxsat-hdr.wikispaces.com/Review+Links


Sure mate, I'm sure that single cable updating won't be an issue, but it's always nice to know there's a backup system, meaning I can install via USB... or if a new firmware comes out, which can be easily downloaded and installed, before it broadcasts over the air... much like we do with the Toppy.

Thanks for the link, I'll have a browse later, though it's too late now, unit ordered Smile

Thanks for your input,
Vin.

_________________
Toppy:TF5800 F/W:1365BfBqCeCyEcErEsFGmHMhNfPPcPfRRpSSrT2UXpXw
TAPs: Movie Progress V3.2 - Jag's EPG v3.0 Beta 2 (Full Version) - UK Timers v1.2 - DescriptionExtender 2.1 - mcgCYRResume V1.0 - Power Manager v2.0 - MyInfo A4
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Vindictor
Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:08 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Cornwall
Just to say, that my Humax arrived a little while ago, as did my crossover cable.

Just plugged it all in, got it working very quickly, although I have no audio over HDMI, but I think this is a fault with my HDMI splitter, but for now have audio coming over SPDIF to my amp.

Just flicked through the channels, a fair few there.
Set a timer for The Jackal on BBCHD tonight as I love that film, so will be nice to see it in HD, as I don't even think it's out on bluray.

As others have said, the menus are less than intuitive. I'm quite a techy person, but even then, the menus didn't exactly respond how I'd expect them to... like pressing the back button on some menus doesn't take you back, but on others it does, but nothing too bad... I think after a day or two I'll be used to it.

I was very tempted to alter in the menu, in the same way I did the Toppy with JAGS, to set all progs to start 2 mins early and 5 mins late, to make sure I don't miss the beginning or end of any programmes, but I remember reading that Freesat has some kind of broadcaster info, which means if left on auto, it can automatically change the start/end times?
Anybody have any experience of this? IE. does it work? Or should I just set all timers to start a few mins before and after, like I've always done with the Toppy?

Just out of interest, I've jumped into a manual tune, to find non-Freesat channels, blimey... 35% through 412 channels found so far! I told it to only search for FTA as well.

As has been posted previously, I guess I'll always need to exit Freesat mode to get at these..a shame you couldn't make a sort of global favourites channel list, and include channels from both. Never mind, it'll be interesting to see what's on there later.

I've only seen BBCHD preview so far, as it's not 4pm yet... that looks pretty damn good!

So, literally only just starting, but seriously impressed so far.
The menus could confuse some I'm sure, but I don't think it'll be a problem.

I love the OSD, looks pretty Wink

90% through now, 486 channels found, and I see some interesting ones found in the list. I wonder if these will join Freesat at some point, and therefore appear in the EPG.

OK, 477 channels found, it's finished, so I'm off for another play.

Thanks again to all for your input.

By the way, as recommended, I peeled off the thin plastic cover off the front, and also the one inside the flap... and I haven't found the remote too directional as others had posted.

Vin.

_________________
Toppy:TF5800 F/W:1365BfBqCeCyEcErEsFGmHMhNfPPcPfRRpSSrT2UXpXw
TAPs: Movie Progress V3.2 - Jag's EPG v3.0 Beta 2 (Full Version) - UK Timers v1.2 - DescriptionExtender 2.1 - mcgCYRResume V1.0 - Power Manager v2.0 - MyInfo A4
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Wildoat
Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:42 pm Reply with quote
MyStuff Team Joined: 18 Apr 2005 Posts: 532 Location: Diss / Tacolneston Transmitter
Hi,

Glad you like it. Re programme starts and setting padding - I have had on auto and it has worked like a dream - nearly as good as R2D2's extend TAP!!

W.

_________________
TAPS: TF5000 Display : MyStuff : epg2mei : Extend : FontManager : seccacheUK : eit_sub_sng : SDS : MhegOnOff.
Topfield Model: TF5800PVR Silver (400GB UpGrade) - Firmware version: 5.13.65 Heavily Patched!.

Networked via Homeplug: Asus WL-500GX + Olegs firmware 1.9.2.7-7g + ftpd-topfield 0.7.4.
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Vindictor
Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 4:06 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 06 Oct 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Cornwall
Wildoat wrote:
Hi,

Glad you like it. Re programme starts and setting padding - I have had on auto and it has worked like a dream - nearly as good as R2D2's extend TAP!!

W.


Well that's great news then.
I was very tempted to just go with what I know, and set padding, but I shall leave it set to auto for now.

Yes, I'm very pleased. Shame that a few channels, like Sky News and RockworldTV are only available on non-Freesat mode, but that's hardly the fault of Humax! Wink

I've set a bunch of timers, from BBC-HD and ITV-HD. There's more on there than I'd thought, though still not a great deal. Even Grimebusters is in HD, and the Footy too!

So, I have some ITV-HD and BBC-HD timers set.
I've also set a series link for one of the shows on Horror that I'd never heard of, just to try it. (Millennium, it just happens to start today with S01E01, so I thought I'd try it out)

I'm only concerned about one thing.

On my Toppy, when I set a timer, and there's no tuner available, I get a warning message.

Because this is satellite, and I run the loopthrough cable, I'm not sure what's going to happen when two timers clash. Certainly the series link I just set, clashes with one of my ITV-HD timers.

So, I'm wondering which of the two will record, or whether they'll both crash out. I guess I'll find out when it happens, but that's my only concern. It would be great if there was a warning, but I didn't receive one. Maybe ITV-HD and Zone Horror can both be viewed/recorded at the same time. Still, apart from that, just worried about clashing timers, I am delighted.
Pic quality is higher than I'd even expected. BBC-HD has kicked off now, and even though there's only some kids show on, it looks beautiful, and got 5.1 sound as well.

So, all the info in here lead to my purchase, so many thanks.
Was a good buy, as I've said before, not to replace the Toppy, but certainly to go in addition to. Got all the bases covered now, with multi tuners for Freeview, and the ability to record Freesat HD stuff too.

Cheers,
Vin.

EDIT: has anybody ever found a way to disable the Time Shift service, so the HDD isn't running all the time? Also, has anybody actually plugged in an ethernet cable to see if it does anything yet? I saw there's a page to set it up with an IP address etc. I have a spare slot in a switch in the room next door, so if it does anything useful, I'll run another cable through the wall, but just thought I'd check if it would be worth doing first.

EDIT: OK, still learning as I go... seems it DOES warn me when no tuner is available Smile I just tried to set the timer on BBC-HD for Yellowstone tomorrow, as I thought that may be something worth watching in HD, and it warned me about my reservation for Scorpian King on ITV-HD at the same time, so that's ideal, it does warn me. (of course it would be even more ideal if I could record both at once, but at the moment, I'm still considering myself lucky that I can get HD at all. Shame BBCHD doesn't seem to repeat stuff as often as other channels. Still, if Yellowstone is on again in the furture, I'll give it a go.)

Also, another great feature that I wasn't expecting.
I have a timer set for 19:00 tonight. Out of interest, I clicked on The One Show on BBC1 (south west) as it just happens to be on next, and at the same time. Sure enough, up came the warning that there was a conflict, however this time, it recommended to me another channel I could record it on, in this case, BBC1 Scotland! So, I thought that was clever, and quite unexpected, so even though I don't really want to record The One Show, the option is there should I need it. In due course, I'll find out if it automatically searches for a repeat in case of a timer conflict.
Anyway, I'm impressed again Smile

_________________
Toppy:TF5800 F/W:1365BfBqCeCyEcErEsFGmHMhNfPPcPfRRpSSrT2UXpXw
TAPs: Movie Progress V3.2 - Jag's EPG v3.0 Beta 2 (Full Version) - UK Timers v1.2 - DescriptionExtender 2.1 - mcgCYRResume V1.0 - Power Manager v2.0 - MyInfo A4
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aws
Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 12:17 pm Reply with quote
Frequent contributor Joined: 23 Apr 2006 Posts: 114 Location: North Chingford
Another quite convoluted and of course *theoretical* way would be to record the HD content to Blu-ray using a suitably equipped recorder, then import the AVCHD files into Windows using some software like AnyDVD-HD which will then allow you to access the video files on that disc.

Convoluted, expensive, *theoretical*, and in the long term pointless really, given that most good HD content goes pretty quickly to sell / rent through on BluRay, which then doesn;t have the various lossy transcodes degrading the quality.

AWS





Vindictor wrote:

There's a hush-hush-ish project run by the BBC Research Dept which acts like an iPlayer with no timeout, and the downloads are at full TX quality ie 16-17Mb/s for HD with (as far as I know) no copy protection flags. I suspect someone within the BBC with access to that system is being naughty and putting them on Torrents.

Could be wrong though.

quote]

_________________
TF5800, IA On, TS On, F/W: 13.65AbBfBqCeCkCpCwCyDeEcEeEfEpErEsFFmGmHHeKtMhNfOtPPcRRaReRhRpRsSSdSlSrStT2TdTeTfTpTsVrXpXwXl
TAPs: EPG2MEI v0.96; MyStuff 6.1; Font Manager 1.0d; Extend v1.7; MyInfo B1; TF5000 Display v1.43;
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